Gotta post anonymously. A wierd situation - bank says that since its HELOC is accessible by a card as well as by checks, it doesn't need a separate note for customers to sign at the time of origination. After all, no one signs a contract to get a credit card - the application and terms and conditions brochure suffice. What arguments can I raise to go beyond saying that gee, whiz, it's industry practice to have a legal contract when you put your home on the line?

What does the mortgage refer to? Generally, with loans, it refers to 'note of even date'. I side with you - there should definitely be a note.

The bank developed an open-end mortgage that is recorded, but that the customer must specifically request in order to get a copy. So - for those customers who keep a copy of the mortgage, it says that the mortgage secured repayment to the bank under the [HELOC] account. The mortgage refers to the HELOC terms and conditions brochure twice, once under default provisions, and once under future advances provisions. Other than the date by any signature, there is no date given for the opening of the HELOC account.

I'm no lawyer, but somehow this seems awfully weak.

The analogy to a credit card doesn't work for me - credit cards are generally unsecured debt.....as opposed to any debt (such as the HELOC) secured by real property. I'm on your side.