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#801609 - 08/23/07 04:41 PM POD/POA
#Just Jay Online
10K Club

Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 13530
Loc: Cheeseheadland
Need some Wisconsin help here folks -

In reading a couple of other posts has me thinking... where can I find, or which state statutes should I refer to see our state's rules regarding POA's on POD accounts, and their abilities to make changes, if any?
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I don't like making plans for the day because then the word "premeditated" gets thrown around in the courtroom.

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#801667 - 08/23/07 05:21 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: #Just Jay]
CSB1 Offline
Diamond Poster

Registered: 12/03/03
Posts: 1061
Loc: Wisconsin
Look at Chapter 705 of Wisconsin Statutes. I think this might help you.

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#801684 - 08/23/07 05:37 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: CSB1]
#Just Jay Online
10K Club

Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 13530
Loc: Cheeseheadland
Looks good - thanks!
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I don't like making plans for the day because then the word "premeditated" gets thrown around in the courtroom.

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#1202610 - 06/17/09 12:54 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: #Just Jay]
Hockey Rules Offline
100 Club

Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 205
Loc: Packer Country
One more question regarding POA making changes to a POD. We use the WBA Agent Designation for POA's. The POA wants to put himself as POD and remove the current POD. Is it stated anywhere that he can do this? He also has POA papers from an attorney that state he can make these types of changes, but we prefer to use our WBA forms. Thanks
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“Hakuna Matata”

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#1203455 - 06/18/09 11:11 AM Re: POD/POA [Re: Hockey Rules]
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club

Registered: 07/09/03
Posts: 13761
POA papers from an attorney are perfectly acceptable. There is no reason to make anyone use the forms you prefer if they've paid good money to have forms drafted. If he has the proper power, how can you stop him from making changes?

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#1205144 - 06/22/09 11:28 AM Re: POD/POA [Re: Truffle Royale]
KerryG Offline
100 Club

Registered: 12/22/06
Posts: 105
Loc: WI
We, too, prefer to have the WBA forms completed. This is because we want to be sure the durable POA language is present. If the customer is adamant they do not want to sign the WBA agreement, we have the tellers/CSRs elevate it to determine if the durable language is present or not.

Hockey - as a general rule, a POA does not have estate planning abilities, meaning they can not remove a current POD or name a new POD. The account owners are the only ones that have the power to designate and/or remove PODs.

I agree with TR, if he has a legal document stating he can make these types of changes...
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I'm not a lawyer and I don't play one on TV. My opinion is my own and does not constitute legal advice.

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#1206983 - 06/24/09 01:29 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: KerryG]
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club

Registered: 07/09/03
Posts: 13761
Originally Posted By: Kerry G
We, too, prefer to have the WBA forms completed. This is because we want to be sure the durable POA language is present. If the customer is adamant they do not want to sign the WBA agreement, we have the tellers/CSRs elevate it to determine if the durable language is present or not.
What am I missing here? Why would you make a customer sign a WBA form if they walked in with a valid POA already completed? One of the primary functions of any POA is to speak to durability. It sounds to me like a bad case of 'we've always done it this way' itis.

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#1206996 - 06/24/09 01:41 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: Truffle Royale]
hmdagal Offline
Power Poster

Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 3525
I'm not sure what we do here, but I could make a point for preferring the use of WBA forms. We know what they say, and they've been reviewed by attorneys for both the WBA and the bank. If a customer brings in their own form, it would need to be reviewed by someone high enough up the food chain to understand any nuances it might have.

In your world, Truff, you're just looking for authorization for a mortgage loan. When deposit accounts are involved it's another animal entirely.

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#1207055 - 06/24/09 02:24 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: hmdagal]
Hockey Rules Offline
100 Club

Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 205
Loc: Packer Country
That is the reason we ask for the WBA form. I understand the reason for accepting the one they present but then we run into; what if the names changed, what if their limits changes, or we don't understand the verbiage and now we need to bring in legal, etc. I can see both sides but like said above 'this has always been the recommended/safe approach' to keep us out of court. I would love to hear from others as to how they do it if they accept the attorney prepared POA documents.
thanks
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“Hakuna Matata”

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#1207082 - 06/24/09 03:00 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: Hockey Rules]
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club

Registered: 07/09/03
Posts: 13761
Not just POAs for mortgages here. I've spent time working for attorneys too. I just don't see why you would have to review a POA. If an attorney's name is on it as having drafted it, it's his license on the line. And you CAN take that to the bank.

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#1207194 - 06/24/09 03:52 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: Truffle Royale]
Hockey Rules Offline
100 Club

Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 205
Loc: Packer Country
Can anyone else tell me what they do or are recommended to do? How can the first attorney be held liabable if the copy we hold is 10 years old and the customer has had a new one written up by a new attorney that states it takes precedent over any/all previous ones?
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“Hakuna Matata”

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#1207447 - 06/24/09 09:49 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: Hockey Rules]
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club

Registered: 07/09/03
Posts: 13761
Don't worry. I won't answer your question again. I have one for you tho.

If a POA is a legal document of the same caliber as say a will which would also state it takes precidence over all previous ones, on what basis are you saying it doesn't? A new will might be done by a different attorney ten years after the first but it's certainly not invalidated by the fact that a previous one exists.

I'm really just trying to understand where you're coming from on this.

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#1207639 - 06/25/09 10:31 AM Re: POD/POA [Re: Truffle Royale]
Hockey Rules Offline
100 Club

Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 205
Loc: Packer Country
Let's try this, a customer of the bank has a CD with us for 100,000. They have given us the POA papers at account opening in 1990 which include Jane and Jo as POA's to be able to do any and everything including appoint/remove POD's. In 1999 Jo comes in and places his name as POD. The owner passes away in 2001. Jo comes in and takes the 100,000. Jane comes in a week later looking the CD as she is personal rep of the estate. We explain that Jo already took the monies because he was POD. Jane said that he didn't have authority to do this because in 1992 they made new POA documents which replaced the old ones. Now, I know that this would be one that could be fought because they didn't give us the new papers. Hence, the reason we want to stick with our forms where we know that it can't be changed unless they do a new form with us. Does that clear it up at all?
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“Hakuna Matata”

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#1207842 - 06/25/09 12:40 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: Hockey Rules]
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club

Registered: 07/09/03
Posts: 13761
Yes. Now I understand where you're coming from.

Is there some sort of language in the WBA form you use that states that it can only be replaced by another form done at your bank? Otherwise, my question remains the same. What prohibits them from filling out your form and then having a new POA that suppercedes your's prepared by an attorney who's doing their will a year from now?

My point from the beginning has been that it's hard for me to imagine that any form is going to be iron clad in the manner you're presenting.

btw, thanks for taking the time to explain. learn and grow, right?

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#1208087 - 06/25/09 05:32 PM Re: POD/POA [Re: Truffle Royale]
Hockey Rules Offline
100 Club

Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 205
Loc: Packer Country
No problem, this has been fun. If they sign our WBA form, they are responsible to change that form as they need to. It the contract that they hold with us. If they do a different one outside of the bank, our form is still the contract they signed with us and holds tight. smile
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“Hakuna Matata”

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