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#118102 - 09/26/03 10:30 PM HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
zaibatsu Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
The Home Equity vote will be certified at 2:30 pm on Monday, September 29th.

Are your attorneys telling you that you can't close a home equity loan after 2:30 on September 29th until 2:30 October 11th. Why you ask?

1. Because the disclosure has changed; and

2. You can't legally give the new disclosure before 2:30 on September 29th and if you give the old disclosure before then, you have not given the proper disclosure for a closing that takes place after 2:30 on the 29th.

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE, THIS IS ONLY A QUESTION FOR DISCUSSION.
Last edited by zaibatsu; 09/26/03 10:31 PM.
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#118103 - 09/29/03 05:07 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
Lestie G Offline

Power Poster
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,606
Near the Land of Enchantment
Yep, that's what they're telling me!
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#118104 - 09/29/03 08:45 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
Anonymous
Unregistered

Is this only for HELOC's or does this apply to close-end Home Equity loans also (since the "Notice Concerning Extensions of Credit also changed for these loans)?

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#118105 - 09/29/03 08:47 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
juliad Offline
Gold Star
juliad
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 445
Dallas, TX
I believe it is for both HELOCs and the closed-end Home Equity loans.

I'm still waiting for the "official" word that the certification is final. Any news?
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#118106 - 09/30/03 03:27 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
RBanker Offline
Power Poster
RBanker
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,675
Austin Texas
The following is from Karen Neely, general counsel with IBAT. - if you're bank is a member of IBAT, I would suggest contacting her or Jack Burkett for additional information.

HOME EQUITY UPDATE. Governor makes it official! Today at 2:30 p.m.,
the governor is certifying the vote on the constitutional amendments.
That means that the home equity changes are effective today. Many of
the larger banks have been advertising home equity lines of credit and
taking applications. They must provide the new, revised notice no
earlier than today and begin the twelve day clock running.

So, does this affect pending closed end transactions? In my opinion,
if you took a normal closed end application, then the old notice is
okay. Here's why:

1. That is the notice that was required by law when the transaction
was initiated.
2. The revised notice has little new that affects the closed end
transaction (other than the bi-weekly payment option).
3. The Texas Supreme Court has opined that the substantive law
controls over the notice and that the notice can be amplified/changed as
needed. To me, that says that the changes regarding open end credit in
the new notice are not critical for a closed end transaction.

Beginning today, use the new notice with new transactions. But before
then on closed-end transactions, the old notice should be effective.

A word of caution: At the TBA seminar, the speaker is recommending
giving the new notice and starting the time frame all over again. I
disagree (and I have informally reviewed this with regulators), but I
want to share his viewpoint with you.

Bottom line: I disagree that you have to start all over if not
"booked" by Monday! The notice should be effective if it was valid when
given.

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My comments are absolutely no reflection of, nor influenced by, my employer - take them at your own risk.

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#118107 - 09/30/03 06:01 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
Anonymous
Unregistered

Bottom line: Doesn't matter what TBA says. Doesn't matter what Karen Neeley says. Doesn't matter what the regulator says. What matters is what your attorney says and your bank decides to do.

Not knocking Karen--What she says makes sense, but who knows!? Her license is not on the line. There sure are a lot of attorneys with their licenses on the line (meaning they are giving legal advice they are paid for) who are saying otherwise

What good does it do you to contact IBAT, Karen or Jack. You need to consult your bank's attorney and if he or she wants to call them--great! YOU SHOULD NOT MAKE YOUR DECISION ON THIS BASED ON CALLING A TRADE ASSOCIATION!!!!

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#118108 - 09/30/03 06:09 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
rlcarey Online
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rlcarey
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 79,637
Galveston, TX
I have to concur with Anonymous on that point. The trade association is not going to foot the bill if you get sued. This is something on which you should be relying on sound legal counsel.
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The opinions expressed here should not be construed to be those of my employer: PPDocs.com

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#118109 - 09/30/03 10:22 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
RBanker Offline
Power Poster
RBanker
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,675
Austin Texas
While I certainly appreciate that input that other 'members' give, I must admit to a certain suspicion when they refuse to identify themselves - And I certainly don't gainsay that what 'Anonymous' shares has some very good merit. But why hide who you are? It makes me feel that axes are being ground?!
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My comments are absolutely no reflection of, nor influenced by, my employer - take them at your own risk.

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#118110 - 09/30/03 10:25 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
RBanker Offline
Power Poster
RBanker
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 2,675
Austin Texas
PS - Our attorneys, whom we pay the proverbial 'tub-load' of money to have advised our institution to observe the 'black-out' period. Again, to reiterate, 'Anonymous' point, those are our attorneys, not anyone elses, and really that is who you should listen to - Your legal counsel - Good point 'Anonymous'
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My comments are absolutely no reflection of, nor influenced by, my employer - take them at your own risk.

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#118111 - 09/30/03 10:44 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
zaibatsu Offline
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
I don't understand how his/her anonymity brings suspicion on this advice? Looks like sound advice to me! I couldn't have said it better myself.
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#118112 - 10/01/03 01:44 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
Lestie G Offline

Power Poster
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,606
Near the Land of Enchantment
I attended the TBA seminar yesterday - and what the presenter said was pretty much what Anonymous said. He emphasized that IBAT (Karen) was saying don't worry about it, and that other attorneys were interpreting the requirement differently, due to an Attorney General's opinion from late 1997. He emphatically stated over and over to contact your bank counsel and follow their advice. The presenter was a well-respected attorney as well.

By the way - as I stated above, ours said to give the notice and start the waiting period over again.
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#118113 - 10/01/03 02:01 PM Re: HEL Closings from Sep 29 to Oct 11
zaibatsu Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
The presenter was Michael O'Neal from Winstead & Secrest. My opinion is that Mike and his firm are the best, most forthright group of attorneys practicing banking law in the State of Texas. If I were a small town banker, I'd put his name in my Rolodex for the next time a matter was too much for my local counsel.
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