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#1232493 - 08/13/09 08:46 PM CTR Negotiable Instrument & Deposit/Withdrawal
leo_bsayer Offline
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I have a question that I hope Ken can answer regarding CTRs. I participated in the webinar on completing CTRs that you held on 8/11/2009. One of my questions, which you included in your Questions and Answers section, was regarding negotiable instruments. I think maybe my question was unclear. If I cash a check on an account that I hold at my bank, and the transaction is reportable, my understanding is you would check "negotiable instrument cashed", "account number affected" (and list account number), and "deposit/withdrawal". But if I cash an "on us" check in a reportable amount that my best friend wrote me, would I complete the CTR the same way by also checking the deposit/withdrawal box since it is removing funds from an account held at the institution? I hope that makes sense.

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#1232542 - 08/13/09 09:40 PM Re: CTR Negotiable Instrument & Deposit/Withdrawal leo_bsayer
Elwood P. Dowd Offline
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Next to Harvey
In the first example, cashing a check on your account, the bank would check the deposit/withdrawal box (Item 34) because it is your account.

In the second, the bank would not check that box. You are not making a withdrawal from your friend's account, you are simply cashing a check.

In both cases, you would check the box that indicates you are cashing a negotiable instrument (Item 32) and include the account number.

That's based in large part on 1995 guidance published by Treasury on CTR completion. However, it has been modified slightly based on repeated, consistent comments I've heard from FinCEN personnel that they want the negotiable instrument box checked even when a customer is withdrawing money from her own account if there is a check involved.

They want to know they are looking for a check.

The guidance:

24. Question: When an individual presents an on-us check drawn on an account of someone other than the presenter's account, which box should a reporting bank check? When an individual presents an on-us check drawn on the account of the presenter to withdraw funds from his/her own account, which box should be checked?

Answer: When an individual presents an on-us check drawn on an account of someone other than the presenter's account, the bank should check box 32 (Negotiable Instruments(s) Cashed). When an individual presents an on-us check drawn on the account of the presenter to withdraw funds from his/her own account, box 32 could be checked or box 34 (Deposit(s)/Withdrawal(s) may bec (sic) checked to indicate that the transaction is a withdrawal. In any case, list account numbers in Item 35 (Account Number(s) Affected).
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#1232562 - 08/13/09 09:58 PM Re: CTR Negotiable Instrument & Deposit/Withdrawal Elwood P. Dowd
leo_bsayer Offline
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 645
Ken, thanks very much for that answer. It is the one I have been looking for. Can you tell me the website that has that official guidance you quoted? I really appreciate it.

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#1232563 - 08/13/09 09:59 PM Re: CTR Negotiable Instrument & Deposit/Withdrawal leo_bsayer
leo_bsayer Offline
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Posts: 645
Sorry. I know you said FinCEN, but I thought there might be a page specifically referencing questions like the one I asked.

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#1232649 - 08/14/09 11:17 AM Re: CTR Negotiable Instrument & Deposit/Withdrawal leo_bsayer
Retread Offline
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Retread
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The guidance Ken is referring to can be found at:

http://www.fdic.gov/news/news/inactivefinancial/1995/fil9570a.html
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#1232650 - 08/14/09 11:22 AM Re: CTR Negotiable Instrument & Deposit/Withdrawal leo_bsayer
Elwood P. Dowd Offline
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Elwood P. Dowd
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 21,939
Next to Harvey
Leobsayer,
Retread is not only "The Keeper of the Gates of Wisdom," he is our primary archivist.

To put his link in perspective, this Guidance is not found on the FinCEN web site. However, it was circulated by the FDIC in an FIL 14 years ago and Retread knows where the FDIC stores its inactive (old) FILs.
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