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#1578510 - 07/15/11 01:47 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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From that standpoint, I agree with you, the numbers are public information. But giving your number to somebody upon request is different than allowing somebody to act under your number. I am not sure what kind of use the customers will be deriving from these numbers, but I could see them completely forgetting that they actually talked to John Doe in the beginning of the application process and being dissatisfied with Peter Johnson NMLS ID#123456 if something goes wrong.

I am thinking about this option, though, as the other option is discontinuing their services for this kind of applications.
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#1578514 - 07/15/11 01:49 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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Originally Posted By: raitchjay
...by the way the regulation reads, if somebody at this company that takes applications for you met one of your LOs in the street and said "hey...what's your NMLS number?", technically, your LO would be required to give...


I challenge you to find where this is required... running into someone of a certain profession while engaging in the act of the profession is no grounds for required disclosure. Yes, these are public numbers, but LOs are not on the clock 24/7 are not obligated to provide their number until they are engaging in meaningful dialouge with a potential borrower.

And doedoe, I concur, I too would not want the third party issuing that number to any indiviual applicant, especially if they do not know who will be responsible for the deal... too many potential issues circling that cart as well.

Are you able to require your third party to either direct people to your website to view the listing of numbers, or can they be required to mail a listing of numbers upon request, or are they simply gathering and passing on the data and no more?
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#1578521 - 07/15/11 01:57 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # #Just Jay
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I haven't thought of directing people to the website. That could potentially work, unless, again, the person is not at a computer at the time or does not know how to use one. And we have over a hundred registered MLOs, so getting the list will not help the applicant feel "safer" in the process.

Right now they are simply gathering the data and passing it on to us. We send all the disclosures and approval or denial decisions. But that is the mid-point of the application process, and the number needs to be given before it begins.
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#1578522 - 07/15/11 01:58 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # #Just Jay
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(b) A registered mortgage loan originator shall provide his or her unique identifier to a consumer:

(1) Upon request;

I think that's pretty straightforward. Jay, the scenario i quoted was purely theoretical....the vast majority of people couldn't care less what an LO's # is. I'm just saying the regulation doesn't treat NMLS #s like SSN's to be protected and guarded. In my example, granted, i should have made clear i meant if an employee of that company as a consumer walking down the street in every day life.
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#1578528 - 07/15/11 02:01 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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"Yes, these are public numbers, but LOs are not on the clock 24/7 are not obligated to provide their number until they are engaging in meaningful dialouge with a potential borrower."

I'm not saying i disagree that this would be a good idea, but i don't see how it jibes with:

"A registered mortgage loan originator shall provide his or her unique identifier to a consumer: upon request;"
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#1578543 - 07/15/11 02:17 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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"upon request" is not at the moment either.

SAFE Act does not define the time frames of 'upon request', nor does it mandate the method to which it is provided.

If I see you at the street fair on Saturday afternoon and you ask for my identifier, there is nothing in SAFE that would say I am wrong to tell you "I will email it to you on Monday when I am back in the office".

Yes, we as a FI have to have published lists ready to go to provide to the public upon request. But again, there is a two prong 'and' test before you are required to provide when acting on your own as an MLO. I feel in doedoe's situation, if they consistently provide the NMLS # of the MLO for that consumer deal when they send out the earlies, they will be just fine, should they continue to work with this third party.
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#1578552 - 07/15/11 02:25 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # #Just Jay
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Leaving doedoe's situation aside: the two-prong test IMO is simply for purposes of deciding if an MLO needs to register or remain unregistered. I see nothing in "A registered mortgage loan originator shall provide his or her unique identifer to a consumer upon request" that says or even implies "but only after the MLO has met both prongs for that consumer". My point in all this is that i really don't see how a company that you trust enough to take applications for you (and really, even a company that you don't trust) can "do something bad" with the NMLS #s of your MLOs.
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#1578565 - 07/15/11 02:34 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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And my point is that why would you want a third party company who is not required to provide an NMLS# of their own, providing indivudal NMLS#'s when they may not have the ability to know which MLO that deal is going to end up with??

We shall agree to disagree. As Bob tthe Banker often says, it is up to us to determine what is appropriate for our own shops.
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#1578574 - 07/15/11 02:39 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # #Just Jay
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Originally Posted By: Just Jay
And my point is that why would you want a third party company who is not required to provide an NMLS# of their own, providing indivudal NMLS#'s when they may not have the ability to know which MLO that deal is going to end up with??


Which is why i asked in my original post if they had the capability to know which MLO would be dealing with which application. But good discussion.
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#1578578 - 07/15/11 02:43 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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I e-mailed NCUA's examinations division with this question, I'll give you an update once I hear back from them.
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#1578581 - 07/15/11 02:46 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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Originally Posted By: raitchjay

Which is why i asked in my original post if they had the capability to know which MLO would be dealing with which application. But good discussion.


Perhaps we did stray.

Discussions with you often good, and challenging. wink
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#1578931 - 07/15/11 08:08 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # Compli(cated)
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Originally Posted By: doedoe
But giving your number to somebody upon request is different than allowing somebody to act under your number.


I missed this post the first time around and just wanted to make this observation: the way i envisioned this would be someone at this company, talking over the phone with a potential applicant, saying "we will forward this application to _____________________ (your bank's name) and ______________________(one of your MLO's names) whose NMLS# is *****."
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#1579040 - 07/15/11 09:58 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # raitchjay
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Originally Posted By: raitchjay
the two-prong test IMO is simply for purposes of deciding if an MLO needs to register or remain unregistered. I see nothing in "A registered mortgage loan originator shall provide his or her unique identifer to a consumer upon request" that says or even implies "but only after the MLO has met both prongs for that consumer".

Very interesting observation.
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#1579843 - 07/19/11 04:26 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # cheech
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This just came up - and my brain hurts from Reg B/V changes - can someone clarify for me. On our business cards we are only putting the NMLS id for the MLO. Not for the institution. Can someone confirm that this is correct?

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#1579855 - 07/19/11 04:28 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # QCL
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We are only putting the MLO number on business cards. There is no requirement to disclose the bank's NMLS number (yet anyway).
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#1579863 - 07/19/11 04:40 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # Dani York, CRCM
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I think the confusion comes from Freddie requiring it on the application. Thanks for everything Dani!

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#1579921 - 07/19/11 05:39 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # QCL
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So do we call it the MLO# or the NMLS ID#??

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#1579924 - 07/19/11 05:41 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # overregulated
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Whatever you wish to use, no requirements one way or another, but I think (think, not know) most are defaulting to NMSL# or NMLS ID#, since NMLS is very google friendly, and brings users right to the NMLS pages, and thus adding some value to using it.
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#1579927 - 07/19/11 05:46 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # #Just Jay
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Thanks!

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#1580253 - 07/20/11 02:32 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # overregulated
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Just heard from our Marketing Dept...the only consistent place they could find to put the NMLS # was on the back, which just has the bank's website address...anyone else doing this?
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#1580258 - 07/20/11 02:33 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # Oviedo Boy
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Back of what?
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#1580269 - 07/20/11 02:39 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # Dani York, CRCM
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Sorry!! Back of the business card...!
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#1580282 - 07/20/11 02:46 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # Oviedo Boy
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No problem. I don't think that's an issue since no one will ever use the blasted number anyway....but could they try to fit it in after the name. It sounds like you have ALOT of info on your business cards.

Ex--John Doe, NMLS 123456
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#1580296 - 07/20/11 02:56 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # Dani York, CRCM
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I hate the way it looks on the back...it's all by itself, almost looks like a typo! We have the name on the right side of the card, so we couldn't fit it there, but I'd prefer to see it underneath the name and title:

john doe
vp, mortgage loan officer
NMLS# 123456
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#1580299 - 07/20/11 02:59 PM Re: Providing NMLS ID # Oviedo Boy
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Just tell marketing it needs to go on the front and they need to figure something out. They don't have to know anything different. laugh
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