We are in a rural community and the 3 MSBs I have, I've always completed the form for them, went over it with them, had them sign, & mailed it for them.

Now I know a few of you will have opinions on this practice & that's not what I'm looking for here.

What I am asking is, these are small businesses, foreign (barely english speaking) individuals. To have them try to understand the BSA E-filing site is near impossible. All they do is cash the occasional check over $1,000 & the whole MSB thing is ridiculous in my opinion.

Can the bank file the form electronically for them? or is this something they're stuck trying to figure out.

You're right, I would have protested and I'm probably going to hurt myself keeping my mouth shut.

MSBs are now allowed to file electonically. However, they can still file on paper if they choose to. It will simply take longer for them to appear in the data base. My assumption is that paper filing will remain available only because of the commonality of the circumstances you mention.

mmmmmmouth shut. I can not hold it in any longer.

If they can not fill out the registration how do you expect them to be able to complete there own BSA/AML program and determine if SARs are needed and file them properly?

Sorry

I am agreement with all of you about MSB's. We have the same situation that we have foreigners running convenience stores and they do not understand filing electronically. I agree with the other poster if they do not understand electronic filing how will they understand setting up programs and report activity. But back to you question. I called the e-filing help desk about this and they told me we could file the form for them. I would just put their e-mail address in the registration.

Personally, the foreigners I've worked with understand computers and government regulatory requirement just fine. They just don't want to have to hassle with it, so if you don't make them, they will continue to pretend they don't understand.

These are not complex MSBs - again, they only qualify because they cash a few checks for their family members. I go over everything with them (I don't just simply complete & mail for them - they get mini training sessions with me).

I did have one MSB who did foreign wire remittances & the whole bit - now HIM I expected a lot from & he was amazing. His program was fabulous & he was great to work with. I was actually bummed to lose his account.

Thanks Ken - it looks like they will have to file electronically by 2013 with the rest of us though. or am I reading this wrong?

http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/nr/pdf/20120314.pdf
All other MSBs may continue to file the legacy FinCEN Form 107 as required by FinCEN until March 31, 2013.

FinCEN is dragging everyone, kicking and screaming or not, into e-filing by March 2013, with very minor exceptions. Don't forget, FinCEN is an arm of Treasury, and Treasury is committed to going all electronic (again, with very minor exceptions) by Spring 2013, too.

If I had a question about e-filing, I would sure call the folks at the Help Desk. The answer you were given establishes that there is not even one more subject on which I would seek their advice.

It isn't up to them to tell you that you can fill out a form for someone else...they are in no position to assess the risks involved.

I'd be interested to know how many SARs are filed by MSBs each year. Without seeing any numbers, I'd bet that only the tiniest percentage of the SAR database is generated by non-financial institution sources.

2010 is the most recent year for which SAR statistics are available:

MSBs - 596,494, trending upward

Depository Institutions - 697,389, trending downward

Whoever you spoke with on the e-filing help desk said you COULD file registration forms for your MSB clients. That doesn't make it a good idea to do so.

I did not say it was a good idea or not, but just repeating what they told me. I understand there are risk involved. There are risks in everything we do. In reading the original poster she was not asking peoples opinion but asked if you can register for the MSB. That was the way I interpreted the post.

Crash it was prolly my comment that sparked the debate. However I will stand with my opinion it does not matter if it is allowed by anyone it is not something I would like to get my bank in the middle of.

EdAudit, I understand what you are saying and I don't want to do their jobs for them either. We are busy enough with our jobs in trying to get it done. I agree with you I don't think the banks should get into the middle of it. We have to more involved that we should but this is due to the regulators. I just wanted to repeat what the e-filing help desk told me.

And for the record, my use of your post as a lever for offering my opinion of the practice wasn't meant to suggest you might be considering completing the registration for the Mom & Pop MSB, Crash. It was meant only to make it clear I was responding to the idea or concept of that level of customer hand-holding. Personally, I think the individual at the e-Filing Help Desk should not have offered it as a possibility because the source of the comment lends credibility to the practice.

John, I understand that now. Thanks for your response.

I love worms & cans & opening them

Thanks everyone for your thoughts & the roundtable discussion. It is very much appreciated.

Wow! Did not see that coming! thanks Ken.

Four factors at work here, I think.

1. Although banks may not sense that suspect activity is shifting away from them and toward other service providers, that is certainly the case. Banks have been at this SAR and CTR filing business a lot longer and are much better at it than check cashers and other MSBs.

2. MSBs are beginning to settle into their roles as SAR-filers.

3. As they have become more accustomed to SAR-filing, they are also more practiced at spotting suspect activity.

4. MSBs are increasingly being hit with penalties and other enforcement actions that seize the attention of other members of the industry.