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#1740253 - 09/12/12 06:03 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
edAudit Offline
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In the past I have purchased a laptop which I use for work. Brief cases, Backpacks tablet all out of my pocket (and I do not get a tax break on any of it, teacher can claim in NY up to $1,500).
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#1740295 - 09/12/12 06:58 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read HappyGilmore
B_F Offline
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Cincinnati, OH
Originally Posted By: HappyGilmore
Originally Posted By: B_F
Originally Posted By: raitchjay
teachers know the salary schedule upon agreeing to take the job and if they didn't like it, they shoulda looked elsewhere.
Except for one thing, if yo udon't like your salary at the bank you work at, you can easily go to another company. With school teachers, they have a choice of working for a private school (usually at lower pay) or a public school district (for the state), and pay is fixed. They can't just switch employers easily and stay in their field.


they can also look at upgrading their education, becoming "certified" which has guaranteed increases, looking at post-secondary schools (colleges, universities, trade schools, community colleges)...there are options...and, most colleges allow children of employees attend tuition free (yes, you are taxed on this benefit...)


Wait, you think that you can just jump from being a teacher in an elementary or Jr. High school to a university? LOL

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#1740308 - 09/12/12 07:17 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
waldensouth Offline
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Well, yes, you can. You simply must have a masters or PHD to teach at the college level. We have a program known as "Move on When Ready" in our high school, where kids who have certain GPAs and a certain SAT score can begin attending college courses AT high school. They have some teachers who are qualified to teach at the local college as well as teaching at the HS. They are also bringing some teachers in from the collge as these kids have a building all to themselves and a regular college schedule.
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#1740314 - 09/12/12 07:32 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
raitchjay Offline
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When i was a teacher the "bump" in pay for having a master's degree was ridiculously low--like $300/yr. vs. without it.
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#1740324 - 09/12/12 07:43 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
Skittles Offline
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In Kentucky it will be $3,500 when my son obtains his masters next year.
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#1740334 - 09/12/12 07:51 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
edAudit Offline
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They can join the corporate world as trainers. If corporations are hiring but away goes the retirement, free healthcare, 4%raises ...
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#1740341 - 09/12/12 07:56 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
raitchjay Offline
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I just didn't realize the gravy train i was on in 1989 when i started teaching at $15,060/yr. smile
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#1740343 - 09/12/12 07:57 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read B_F
Queen Mum Offline
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Originally Posted By: B_F
Originally Posted By: HappyGilmore
Originally Posted By: B_F
Originally Posted By: raitchjay
teachers know the salary schedule upon agreeing to take the job and if they didn't like it, they shoulda looked elsewhere.
Except for one thing, if yo udon't like your salary at the bank you work at, you can easily go to another company. With school teachers, they have a choice of working for a private school (usually at lower pay) or a public school district (for the state), and pay is fixed. They can't just switch employers easily and stay in their field.


they can also look at upgrading their education, becoming "certified" which has guaranteed increases, looking at post-secondary schools (colleges, universities, trade schools, community colleges)...there are options...and, most colleges allow children of employees attend tuition free (yes, you are taxed on this benefit...)


Wait, you think that you can just jump from being a teacher in an elementary or Jr. High school to a university? LOL


Here they wouldn't be teaching if they weren't "certified." Even moving from another state, you have to be certified by Oklahoma. Until then you get substitute pay. I think the increase is $1,200 for a Master's over a Bachelor's. But they spend more than than in the years it takes them to go to night class to get there. And you have to have a Master's to teach at the university level.

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#1740345 - 09/12/12 07:58 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read raitchjay
edAudit Offline
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sounds like what a teller would make at that time. Starting sal vs starting sal.
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#1740349 - 09/12/12 08:00 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
raitchjay Offline
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Sorry Ed, but if you're saying a starting teller at a bank and a starting teacher at a public school should make the same salary, i disagree.
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#1740351 - 09/12/12 08:05 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read edAudit
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Originally Posted By: EdAudit
sounds like what a teller would make at that time. Starting sal vs starting sal.

I wish! After 5+ years (and two promotions) at a community bank, my salary is finally equal to what a first year teacher makes in our county. When I started as a teller, the pay was barely over minimum wage (and would have been roughly 1/2 of a first year teacher's salary at the time).

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#1740356 - 09/12/12 08:12 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
edAudit Offline
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If you stayed a teacher in 1989 you would have been retired 3 years now and recieving a paycheck.
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#1740366 - 09/12/12 08:30 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
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Why does a Chicago teach need to make twice as much (median for Chicago teach is $70,000) as a private sector employee (median for Chicago private sector employee is $37000). That does not include benefits that private sector employees can only dream about.

While I realize here in AZ, in OK, and many other parts of the country, teachers don't make that kind of money, but we are talking about Chicago teachers striking where their median slary is double private sector employees and they have been offered 4% annual raises for the contract they have gone to strike over.

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#1740371 - 09/12/12 08:35 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
raitchjay Offline
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I disagree with teachers striking during a school year for pretty much any reason, period. Straw, I would have thought that $70,000 in Chicago equated to about $40,000 here in Oklahoma and i would have thought $37,000 in Chicago barely put you above the poverty line. I agree....i don't have any sympathy for them if that's the case.
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#1740380 - 09/12/12 08:43 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
edAudit Offline
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bigest part of the problem is the people making $37,000. need to pay the salary of those making $70,000. When you factor in that teachers are only part of the muni. salaries you have a workforce of 60% private and 40% gvment. Private is working for 45 years to get to retirement, government working for 20 years. so you are paying more than 2 people (one on retirement) to do the job of 1. Where is the money going to come from?
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#1740382 - 09/12/12 08:47 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
raitchjay Offline
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Ed, again, i can't comment on places like Chicago, but the 20 years you're quoting for retirement holds no water in places like Oklahoma and Texas. When i left Texas, you weren't eligible for retirement until your age plus years of service equalled 85, which for me (if i had bought out my previous service in Oklahoma and transferred it to Texas) would have meant the earliest i could have retired was after 32 years of service. But if you retired before some age (62 maybe?), you didn't get full retirement.
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#1740383 - 09/12/12 08:49 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
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totally different in blue cities like NY and Chicago.

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#1740386 - 09/12/12 08:56 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read raitchjay
edAudit Offline
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Originally Posted By: raitchjay
Ed, again, i can't comment on places like Chicago, but the 20 years you're quoting for retirement holds no water in places like Oklahoma and Texas. When i left Texas, you weren't eligible for retirement until your age plus years of service equalled 85, which for me (if i had bought out my previous service in Oklahoma and transferred it to Texas) would have meant the earliest i could have retired was after 32 years of service. But if you retired before some age (62 maybe?), you didn't get full retirement.


That is where we differ (if we differ) we are not comparing apples to apples (once again).
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#1740400 - 09/12/12 09:28 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
Queen Mum Offline
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In Oklahoma it is now age plus years of service have to equal 90 to be able to draw out of retirement. And your benefits are based upon an average of your final 3 years of service. I have been divorced a year and a half. I was alloted 25% of what my ex-husband would have received at the time of the divorce if he retired then. And he was eligible for retirement at the previous calculation of age + years of service = 80. I think I will receive between $200-$300 a month. He was eligible for retirement, but there is no way he could have survived on retirement alone even if I didn't get any of it. That's why most continue to teach until they either can find another line of work paying more or they can receive Social Security and Medicare. By the time they pay for health insurance there isn't anything left.

Our local school system has lost lots of good male teachers recently. They have taken jobs in the private sector to make more money. They have had it trying to work where your hands are tied and the parents blame you for their child not doing well.
Last edited by Queen Mum; 09/12/12 09:29 PM.
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#1740402 - 09/12/12 09:29 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read raitchjay
Peepers Offline
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Originally Posted By: raitchjay
I just didn't realize the gravy train i was on in 1989 when i started teaching at $15,060/yr. smile


mmmmmmm, gravy
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#1740431 - 09/12/12 11:03 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read HappyGilmore
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Originally Posted By: HappyGilmore
Originally Posted By: B_F
Originally Posted By: HappyGilmore
if you annualize the pay rate of teachers as if they were working all but 2-3 weeks, like most of corporate America, their salary increases by roughly another 33%...
Sorry, but that doesn't work. Many teachers end up PAYING part of their salary during summers each year to work. Yup, continuing education costs them money. Also, they end up spending part of their salaries on supplies for their students and classroom. Can you imagine if you were required to fork over the money for not only all the pens and paper your customers used, but also books, decorations for your bank, etc.?


the continuing education teachers in Louisiana get is paid for by the school system and done at the school or school board office, no cost to the teachers...i also spend part of my money on school supplies for kids who don't have them...as do most other parents whose kids attend public schools.

I work in a back office, no public sees my group...i spend my own money on decorations for most holidays, we host numerous meals each year for employees (out of my pocket), we do ice cream once a month (yep, my pocket again), and i take employees to lunch on their birthday (yep, my pocket again). With 38 employees, i don;t even want to think of how much it costs...



Wow Happy, you really treat them well! Are you hiring??
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#1740481 - 09/13/12 12:48 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read B_F
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Pulling people out of the ditc...
Originally Posted By: B_F
Wait, you think that you can just jump from being a teacher in an elementary or Jr. High school to a university? LOL


why, yes, BF, if one has the educational background, one can. My son's high school lost 3 teachers from last year to the local college...2 were working on their Masters and one the PhD. and were recruited by the college based on their graduation date.

And depending on how fast a college is growing and how badly they need teachers, some have even taken without a masters...
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#1740539 - 09/13/12 02:04 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
MyBrainHurts Offline
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I wonder if the Illinois teachers and other public employees will see all of the fat pensions they've been promised. The state pension system is so underfunded, and the state government just keeps kicking the can down the road. Eventually, the state could have to file bankruptcy. I don't know what will happen to the pensions then. Maybe the federal government will pick up the liability, and then you taxpayers in the other 49 states can pay it.
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#1740556 - 09/13/12 02:29 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read Pale Rider
edAudit Offline
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Pensions are usualy safe from bankrupcy. (the Pols would not allow the paid voters to take the hit)
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#1740582 - 09/13/12 03:01 PM Re: Chicago Teachers on strike, kids can't read HappyGilmore
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Originally Posted By: HappyGilmore
Originally Posted By: B_F
Wait, you think that you can just jump from being a teacher in an elementary or Jr. High school to a university? LOL


why, yes, BF, if one has the educational background, one can. My son's high school lost 3 teachers from last year to the local college...2 were working on their Masters and one the PhD. and were recruited by the college based on their graduation date.

And depending on how fast a college is growing and how badly they need teachers, some have even taken without a masters...


Not here. We have a branch campus of a university in town. The Dean called wanting me to teach a night class on Music History since one of my degrees is Vocal Music Education. Couldn't do it because I don't have a Masters.

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