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#1796873 - 03/20/13 09:51 PM Reg E Errors and benefits
TruthNTime Offline
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TruthNTime
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 84
Texas
I have a member claiming 101 Apple Itunes Charges are not hers. She admits the first charge is hers, then 10 minutes later there are more charges for the same amount. This happens for 28 days (2 to 10 charges per day) and then they reported the rest as unauthorized charges. I do not know if the charges were directed to her account or not, but with a window of 10 minutes for the second charge occurring, I don't believe she was hacked or had card information stolen.

I have set up a computer with Apple Itunes installed so that I can ask if the member will log in and verify that the charges are not purchased for her account. She claims she only authorized one charge. If I find that there are 500 to 1000 songs purchased on her account since the first charge she admits to making, and then she says she did not authorize those charges ("someone else in the house must have done that" might be her excuse), couldn't I deny the claim because she benefitted?

By authorizing her card for her apple itunes account, does it matter if it is her or someone else clicking the 'buy button'? She could have written down her credentials for accessing the apple itunes store, kids logged in and started buying; is that really unauthorized access?

Same thing with Xbox points, I get the member on the phone with Xbox as well, and Xbox rep says the points were purchased for their gamer tag. Member states they did not authorize the points purchase; being that they preauthorized the card for the Xbox, if their friend buys points... he did so with a preauthorized card. In that scenario, is it really unauthorized access? There is no way to prove the member did or did not purchase the points or benefit from the purchase.

Advice please ladies and gents smile

i know I can always start talking police reports and filing charges against someone in their household, and that may be my only tool here.


Last edited by TruthNTime; 03/20/13 09:59 PM.
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Robert R.
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#1796990 - 03/21/13 01:47 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
TruthNTime Offline
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TruthNTime
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 84
Texas
To give clarity, the member only claims one of the charges is hers. There were a total of 102 charges, with only the first being one being claimed as legitimate.
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#1797000 - 03/21/13 01:57 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
TruthNTime Offline
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TruthNTime
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Posts: 84
Texas
Ok, after thinking about this I answered one of my own questions; yes it would be unauthorized access if one of her kids logged into her account and purchased music, the same as if her account were hacked. The difference is that she benefitted from the unauthorized use, now thats not enough to deny a claim but it does lead me to question how she did not notice hundreds of extra songs in her account. I think my only recourse is filing charges with police and asking questions about who is in the home. Which leads me to ask, can I ask who is in the home and name one of them suspect? The mother may decide not to pursue the claim after she understands the legal aspect of the affair.
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Robert R.
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#1797026 - 03/21/13 02:24 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
tdogz Offline
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 229
I always try to direct the customer to contact the merchant's customer support. Often for digital goods, the merchant will just reverse the charge & remove the customer's access to those goods. Most recently, Facebook reversed charges for one of our customers that were unauthorized. I've had decent success with that approach, but results vary.
If we have to refund the customer for the fraud, it is also accompanied by a lecture about account security and linking their debit or credit cards to online accounts. Finally, I recommend that they use gift cards (iTunes, Amazon, Zynga, etc.) as an alternative form of payment.
As for filing charges; we usually tell customers that we will file a report with law enforcement and work with the merchant to identify the suspect if they are claiming that the charges are fraud. Sometimes they'll withdrawal the claim right then. I had someone last week call back the next morning to withdrawal a claim because she didn't want her daughter to 'die in prison.' It was only a $500 claim, so I don't know why she thought she would die in prison?? We never even mention prison, just that we'll file charges.

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#1797040 - 03/21/13 02:39 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
TruthNTime Offline
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TruthNTime
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 84
Texas
Thank you for the information, what you are describing sounds similar to my normal process. The total on this is about $1400.00, and if the music is all in her account then it's just a hard pill to swallow. I may have to use that line; now ma'am, I don't want anyone to 'die in prison' but someone has to pay the price here smile
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Robert R.
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#1797334 - 03/21/13 07:41 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
John Burnett Offline
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Cape Cod
If the cardholder received the benefit of the transaction, the transaction won't meet the definition of "unauthorized." However, I don't understand how you arrive at the decision that your customer benfitted from the transactions that may have been completed by a family member. If my grandson downloads a bunch of games using my account at iTunes, how do I benefit from them?
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#1797367 - 03/21/13 08:19 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
TruthNTime Offline
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TruthNTime
Joined: Dec 2011
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Texas
Only benefited in the sense of receiving the value of the goods, but alas I see it your way; that is the fairest way of handling the situation (and the right way). My problem is that from what my service rep told me, she does not want to file a police report, and is worried I will blame her children. Her worries are well founded, as someone needs to be held accountable. I don't believe we will be allowing her another debit card either way. Thank you for the input John.
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Robert R.
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#1797517 - 03/22/13 01:41 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
TruthNTime Offline
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TruthNTime
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 84
Texas
I had a very frank coversation with our member. After I made the case for why I believed it was a family member, I asked whether the purchase that was authorized was made on a phone, tablet, pc, etc. etc.. It turns out it was made on a phone, the mothers phone. The next question was, who else has an Iphone on the same plan, there were 2 names; I suggested we could narrow down our list for filling a police report to the two individuals other than her mother. I also explained that if the other Iphones on the plan had access to the mother's Itunes account, or if she shared the credentials with them, the charges would not qualify as an error. The daughter then says she just wants to be honest with me, and that it was her younger brother; the rest is history.
Last edited by TruthNTime; 03/22/13 01:42 PM.
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Robert R.
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#1798413 - 03/26/13 06:14 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
YoungAndEager Offline
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#1798414 - 03/26/13 06:16 PM Re: Reg E Errors and benefits [Re: TruthNTime]
Sallaia Offline
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Sallaia
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 42
Tennessee
Just to help with future investigations for iTunes charges, if individuals share the same account, they all have access to the same downloads.

My husband and I initially set up our iPads on the same iTunes account. That didn't last for long because when one of us downloaded a new app, it appeared on the other person's iPad because we both had the same account and were set up to keep things synced. My husband's absolute horror of having Pinterest on his iPad was the straw that broke that camel's back.
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