Learn More - Click Here!

New Reply Thread Options
#1800325 - 04/02/13 01:11 PM VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed
Anonymous
Unregistered

We have a situation where a VOE did not get done till after closing, and it came back that one of our applicants is no longer employed for "health reasons." The loan is in the rescission phase and has not funded. Can we refuse to fund the loan based on the change in employment status (especially if it appears the borrower did not deal with us in good faith regarding their employment status)?

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800331 - 04/02/13 01:18 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
DeeQ Offline
10K Club
DeeQ
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 40,760
Turnpike Exit 10
Loan fraud?
_________________________
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please. - Mark Twain

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800334 - 04/02/13 01:20 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
rlcarey Offline
10K Club
rlcarey
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 77,591
Galveston, TX
If they signed an affidavit that indicates that all financial information remains correct at the time of loan closing, you could contact them and tell them that you have uncovered this information and need to confirm that it is correct and that proceeding with the loan will be considered loan fraud and they are encouraged to rescind the transaction in order to avoid further issues. Then file your SAR.
_________________________
The opinions expressed here should not be construed to be those of my employer: PPDocs.com

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800340 - 04/02/13 01:29 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
Anonymous
Unregistered

In my experience, some borrowers are so "uninformed" they don't realize that quitting a job, changing jobs or even getting fired will affect their loan, typically we verify the new information and run it back through underwritting for a revised approval but have never accused the customer of fraud....just saying.

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800384 - 04/02/13 02:27 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 17,292
Being 'uninformed' is putting it kindly.
We pull a VOE when preparing the closing docs.
Have still had one or two that came back with 'oh, they just quit yesterday' or were fired last week.
Thankfully, at this point, you can just cancel the closing.

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800388 - 04/02/13 02:29 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
Matt_B Offline
Diamond Poster
Matt_B
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,648
A CU, Where Regs Don't Apply
Originally Posted By: Anonymous
In my experience, some borrowers are so "uninformed" they don't realize that quitting a job, changing jobs or even getting fired will affect their loan, typically we verify the new information and run it back through underwritting for a revised approval but have never accused the customer of fraud....just saying.


They may not really realize that structuring or kiting is a big deal either, but they still get a SAR filed on them. It's suspicious, even if it's due to ignorance. Finding out during underwriting or prior to closing would be one thing, after closing, they've certified details they know to be false.
_________________________
Someone's about to get horned!

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800394 - 04/02/13 02:33 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
rlcarey Offline
10K Club
rlcarey
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 77,591
Galveston, TX
In Texas, each borrower has to sign a "Notice of Penalties for Making False or Misleading Written Statement".

WARNING:

Intentionally or knowingly making a materially false or misleading statement to obtain property or credit, including a mortgage loan, is a violation of Section 32.32, of the Texas Penal Code, and, depending on the amount of the loan or value of the property, is punishable by imprisonment for a term of 2 years to 99 years and a fine not to exceed $10,000.00.

I/we, the undersigned home loan applicant(s), represent that I/we have received, read, and understand this notice of penalties for making a materially false or misleading written statement to obtain a home loan.

I/we represent that all statements and representations contained in my/our written home loan application, including statements or representations regarding my/our identity, employment, annual income, and intent to occupy the residential real property secured by the home loan, are true and correct as of the date of loan closing.
_________________________
The opinions expressed here should not be construed to be those of my employer: PPDocs.com

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800426 - 04/02/13 02:59 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
Happy Birthday HappyGilmore Offline
10K Club
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 19,335
Pulling people out of the ditc...
is it possible the applicant is on long-term leave or disbaility for the health reasons, and maybe they think that is considered employed? After all, they could still be receiving pay and benefits from their company...
_________________________
Providing alternative truths since the invention of time

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800427 - 04/02/13 03:01 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
Anonymous
Unregistered

"Intentionally or knowingly" seems to be the key phrase....as has been pointed out above, most of the time they don't "know" what they are doing is fraud. Someone that is intentionally trying to commit fraud would be better at it!!

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#1800465 - 04/02/13 03:56 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
John Burnett Offline
10K Club
John Burnett
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 39,408
Cape Cod
And that is the purpose for forcing an affirmation of the facts at closing. Putting the customer on notice that the change in his circumstances is a material fact and that there are penalties for false statements in connection with a federally-related mortgage loan escalates an "innocent/ignorant oversight" into fraud.

When I last did a refinancing of my home mortgage (more years ago than I recall) the closing attorney made a big deal out of asking whether any statement made in my application relating to my employment, debt or other financial information had changed in any material way since the application had been filed.
_________________________
John S. Burnett
BankersOnline.com
Fighting for Compliance since 1976
Bankers' Threads User #8

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#2134427 - 06/15/17 03:03 AM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
Anonymous
Unregistered

I recently closed on my home loan and my loan will be sold to another lender. I have tow questions regarding this thread...
1. Will the new loan mortgage company do another VOE to serve my loan?

2. I currently work outside of the home, and had been working for the company for about a year, prior to that I worked self employed and made a better solid income, but because of the 2008 mortgage fall out, I would not be able to apply for a first time home buyers mortgage. Now that we have closed, would I be able to go back to being self employed? or will the lender be able to back out of the committment?

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#2134580 - 06/15/17 08:24 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
madukes Offline
Diamond Poster
madukes
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,448
Flyers Country
we've had mortgages where the servicing/mortgagor has changed and they've never required that we provide any updated information. We are notified of our new servicer, effective date and I'm pretty sure they did the notifying of our homeowner's insurance and tax authority because of the escrow.

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
#2134597 - 06/15/17 09:48 PM Re: VOE Done AFTER Closing - Unemployed Anonymous
MScarn6942 Offline
Platinum Poster
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 756
Land Lacking in Lakes, IL
"2. I currently work outside of the home, and had been working for the company for about a year, prior to that I worked self employed and made a better solid income, but because of the 2008 mortgage fall out, I would not be able to apply for a first time home buyers mortgage. Now that we have closed, would I be able to go back to being self employed? or will the lender be able to back out of the committment?"

Anon, I don't have an answer to the first question, but they can't back out of the commitment unless it's specified somewhere on your note that they can do so. Read through that to verify, but that's not something I have ever heard of.
_________________________
"Pressure is something you feel when you don't know what you're doing" - Peyton Manning

Return to Top Reply Quote Quick Reply Quick Quote
Quick Reply:
HTML is disabled
UBBCode is enabled




Moderator:  MagicCity, P*Q, Truffle Royale