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#1819228 - 05/31/13 05:36 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
Rick Bagby Offline
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6
I found a list for 2012 at this URL: http://www.naics.com/naicsfiles/2012_NAICS_Changes.pdf

I also found an Excel sheet of the same information using Google. I was unable to save the URL because it downloaded the sheet right from Google.

If anyone wants either one or both of the items, send an email to rbagby@standingstonenationalbank.com

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#1819234 - 05/31/13 05:47 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
Rick Bagby Offline
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6
Update:

Here is the URL for the Excel spreadsheet:

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=2012%20naics%20codes&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&sqi=2&ved=0CDUQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.census.gov%2Feos%2Fwww%2Fnaics%2Freference_files_tools%2F2012%2F2012_NAICS_Structure.xls&ei=Y-GoUfrYG8rkyAHjzYHYAQ&usg=AFQjCNGDMRJgvpx4E6PalyRN278kkrhYyg&bvm=bv.47244034,d.aWc

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#1819249 - 05/31/13 06:03 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
rlcarey Offline
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Galveston, TX
Those are great, but why not stick with the list issued by FinCEN, as any other codes are prohibited regardless of where you get them.

http://bsaefiling.fincen.treas.gov/docs/2007NAICS.pdf
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#1823631 - 06/14/13 03:09 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
BjK Offline
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 151
Mid USA
I need help finding the right NAICS code for a movie theatre. Does it fall in the Entertainment category under 7139-Other Amusement and Recreation Industries, or Information category 512-Motion Picture and Sound Recording Industries or is there another one that I have missed??? It must be Friday, I can't think this hard smile

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#1823638 - 06/14/13 03:15 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms BjK
Elwood P. Dowd Offline
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Unless you can identify an increment of value, you can instead just type "movie theater" in the "occupation or type of business" box and go on to a more productive exercise.

You are not required to use the NAICS field under any circumstance.
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#1823939 - 06/15/13 05:30 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
rlcarey Offline
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Galveston, TX
But if they insist:

512131 Motion Picture Theaters (except Drive-Ins)

So it would be 512.
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#1823953 - 06/15/13 08:12 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms rlcarey
Elwood P. Dowd Offline
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Slow day in Galveston? grin
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#1828277 - 06/27/13 04:34 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
CynthiaParker Offline
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 45
Midwest
When I spoke with FinCEN, I was told that if you can't find an exact match, leave the NAICS code field blank and enter a detailed description of the occupation/line of business. The person I spoke with seemed to have the opinion that if an individual worked in a listed line of business, the NAICS codes should be included for an individual. Of course, you can get differing opinions depending on who's returning your call.
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#1828389 - 06/27/13 06:42 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
rlcarey Offline
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Galveston, TX
Well, it just goes to prove that FinCEN can read their own FAQs:

19. How do I determine whether or not to indicate a North American Industry Classification System (NAICS) Code?

FinCEN previously issued guidance in March 2012 that addressed the selection of the NAICS Code on the FinCEN CTR and FinCEN SAR. FinCEN emphasized that financial institutions will continue to be expected to provide only that information for which they have direct knowledge. As noted in that guidance, the issuance of the FinCEN CTR does not create any new obligation or otherwise change existing statutory and regulatory requirements for the filing institution. In addition, use of a NAICS code is not mandatory, and a financial institution may still provide a text response with respect to this information within the “Occupation” field. .
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#1830795 - 07/08/13 02:50 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
Islandgirl Offline
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 182
Louisiana
I thought the NAICS code was not a required field. We do not use NAICS codes at my bank. So I do not use them on the CTRs. Do you think I should be using them anyway on the CTR?

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#1830801 - 07/08/13 03:10 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
John Burnett Offline
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Cape Cod
If you don't use them and don't have them assigned to your depositors, you don't have to fill them in on the CTR/SAR filing. Continue supplying a description of the business type.

See FinCEN's Guidance FIN-23012-G002 http://www.fincen.gov/statutes_regs/guidance/pdf/FIN-2012-G002.pdf

See also FinCEN SAR-FAQs, Question 15. http://www.fincen.gov/whatsnew/html/sar_faqs.html

See also FinCEN CTR-FAQs, Question 19. http://www.fincen.gov/whatsnew/html/ctr_faqs.html
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#1845411 - 08/23/13 05:08 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
TryingtoComply Offline
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 2,211
The West
In Ken's webinar yesterday he stated that we only need to provide one or the other. We actually assign codes when accounts are boarded, so we have the information.

I recently assumed responsibility for CTR filings and looked back at forms filed since April 1st when we converted to the new form. Looks like we have been supplying both. Any harm in that?
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#1845414 - 08/23/13 05:11 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
John Burnett Offline
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Cape Cod
No harm, no foul.
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#1845430 - 08/23/13 05:30 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms John Burnett
Elwood P. Dowd Offline
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The refrain: No harm, no foul.
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#1866791 - 10/30/13 08:24 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
mmumm Offline
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 163
Santa Cruz, California
we just noticed that there is a new version of the CTR form 112 that came out in May 2013. Are we required to use this newest version or can we continue using the version prior to it? We have made a number of pre-filled templates for our frequent CTR clients and would prefer not to re-do them.

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#1866838 - 10/30/13 09:34 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms WIBanker91
John Burnett Offline
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John Burnett
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Posts: 40,086
Cape Cod
As long as the substance of the "form" is the same (same fields, for example), but you complete the form in accordance with current instructions, you should not have a problem. I believe that the changes were essentially to the popup instructions provided with the "form."
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#1866919 - 10/31/13 12:45 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms mmumm
Elwood P. Dowd Offline
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Next to Harvey
The current version of the FinCEN CTR (as John's quotation marks suggest, there is no "Form 112") is 1.2. That means there was a 1.0, then a 1.1. While the report's appearance did not change, some of its dynamic did; your templates may work fine until you have a transaction that wants to incorporate a piece of functionality that is simply not there.
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#1867528 - 11/01/13 03:08 PM Re: NAICS code on new CTR and SAR forms Juby
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Our rule of thumb is: occupations for individuals and business descriptions for entities; we only include the FinCEN NAICS code (in addition to the business type) if it's a good fit.
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