Skip to content
BOL Conferences Top Gun 23
Thread Options
#2140394 - 08/01/17 07:43 PM GMI on a different application
Bec Offline
Diamond Poster
Bec
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,114
The Great White North
Lender had borrowers fill out an application for a retail loan and a commercial loan at the same time. Both loans are reportable. Is it ok to refer to a different application for the GMI as they will have their own files. Or would it be prudent to keep a copy of the application in the commercial file as well?
_________________________
Go Packers

Return to Top
HMDA

   
HMDA Academy
#2140402 - 08/01/17 08:51 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
swiggles Offline
Power Poster
swiggles
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,333
GMI attaches only to the application for which it was gathered. You can't use it for an application for another loan. JMO
_________________________
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.......

Return to Top
#2140445 - 08/02/17 03:02 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 17,359
Are there two separate applications or was one only taken to be used for both loans?
Either way, I think using the GMI provided when reporting both loans is fine.
If there is only one app, put a copy in each file and document how and why you're using the information gathered to report on both loans.
If two apps were done, then fill in the GMI on the one that isn't marked and document where and why you obtained it and reference the other file #.

Return to Top
#2140522 - 08/02/17 07:06 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
Bec Offline
Diamond Poster
Bec
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,114
The Great White North
Thanks for the opinions. It was one application that was used for two loans that occurred concurrently.
For what its worth, the approach that you suggested, Truffle, was the one I was thinking we could probably perform and it would be a reasonable solution.
I think for the best scenario they should have filled out a GMI form for the reportable commercial loan and then we didn't have to worry about it. Would that have been your approach Swiggles?
_________________________
Go Packers

Return to Top
#2140527 - 08/02/17 07:12 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
swiggles Offline
Power Poster
swiggles
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,333
Two loans - two applications - two GMI forms.

Amazingly, at a former bank, the compliance officer allowed lenders to use ANY existing GMI form for a subsequent loan.,......never got caught.
_________________________
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.......

Return to Top
#2140556 - 08/02/17 09:18 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 17,359
imho, borrowers shouldn't be made to jump through multiple hoops unless really necessary. So if you have a borrower who is applying for two loans simultaneously, you ask the GMI questions once and put them on both apps and/or any other forms you need. Borrowers won't mind signing twice, but that's all they should be made to do.

fwiw, when we were doing simultaneous first and second loans, we used one app for both and it was never an issue for examiners. The files were crossed referenced and a copy was put in each file.

Return to Top
#2140587 - 08/03/17 02:09 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
swiggles Offline
Power Poster
swiggles
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,333
I see your point, Truffle, and agree, but give and inch and they will take a mile. It's easier to just require a separate GMI form for every loan. I think it would be a rare occasion that the scenario posted here would ever occur.

With respect to simultaneous first and second, yes we would use the same application (including GMI) for both loans.
_________________________
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.......

Return to Top
#2140742 - 08/03/17 09:40 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
David Dickinson Offline
10K Club
David Dickinson
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 18,762
Central City, NE
I'm with Truffle. You can collect GMI once and use it for more than 1 loan. An application is not a piece of paper. It's a request for credit and it can be verbal. Thus, you don't have to have a piece of paper for each application/loan. We need to collect GMI, but it can even be done verbally (the customer doesn't have to mark boxes).
_________________________
David Dickinson
http://www.bankerscompliance.com

Return to Top
#2140877 - 08/04/17 06:09 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
swiggles Offline
Power Poster
swiggles
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,333
We take verbal applications all the time, but we reduce the application to writing on an application form for the file....complete with answers to GMI questions, with "telephone interview" marked. But each application has it's own documentary proof. So it's your opinion that we could simply, upon the first HMDA reportable application, obtain GMI and then just keep relying on that same GMI for subsequent loans? I've never heard of this approach except from the former bank, I mentioned above.
_________________________
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.......

Return to Top
#2140880 - 08/04/17 06:14 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
Bec Offline
Diamond Poster
Bec
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,114
The Great White North
I had to laugh at your comment about taking the GMI from a different application from a previous loan originated years prior. We've had offenders of that. Even with extensive and continual training on how to collect GMI, they still try to pull stuff like that.
_________________________
Go Packers

Return to Top
#2140881 - 08/04/17 06:15 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
RR Joker Offline
10K Club
RR Joker
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 20,654
The Swamp
I don't think the intention of the above answers was to carry it forward into infinity. I believe Reg B is okay with once collected [did not verify it, but I know the rules are different], you're done, but not for HMDA.

If, for instance, you have a request for a construction loan to be paid from a perm loan at the same bank...you have one application serving two loans, but requested at the same time. You don't need GMI for the construction, but you do for the perm. If you use the one application for both 'pieces', it's okay that you collected GMI even when it wasn't required. Same scenario.

However, if 5 years later they come in to refinance their mortgage, you would collect it again...New application, new GMI.
_________________________
My opinion only. Not legal advice.

Say you'll haunt me - Stone Sour

Return to Top
#2140885 - 08/04/17 06:24 PM Re: GMI on a different application RR Joker
swiggles Offline
Power Poster
swiggles
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,333
Okay....well....I'm confused. The original poster insinuated that the two loan requests were not related except that both were HMDA reportable.

Quote:
Both loans are reportable. Is it ok to refer to a different application for the GMI as they will have their own files.
_________________________
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.......

Return to Top
#2140888 - 08/04/17 06:40 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
RR Joker Offline
10K Club
RR Joker
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 20,654
The Swamp
But they were requested at the same time .
_________________________
My opinion only. Not legal advice.

Say you'll haunt me - Stone Sour

Return to Top
#2140895 - 08/04/17 06:59 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
swiggles Offline
Power Poster
swiggles
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,333
Really though, the issue is moot for me because I would never allow it. Quite honestly, I don't think we have ever had that scenario.
_________________________
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.......

Return to Top
#2140929 - 08/04/17 09:31 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
David Dickinson Offline
10K Club
David Dickinson
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 18,762
Central City, NE
Just food for thought, but look at Comment #6 to ยง1002.13(a):

A refinancing occurs when an existing obligation is satisfied and replaced by a new obligation undertaken by the same borrower. A creditor that receives an application to refinance an existing extension of credit made by that creditor for the purchase of the applicant's dwelling may request the monitoring information again but is not required to do so if it was obtained in the earlier transaction.

IOW, under Reg B, if you already have GMI, you don't have to collect it again when you refinance.
_________________________
David Dickinson
http://www.bankerscompliance.com

Return to Top
#2140982 - 08/07/17 01:57 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 17,359
And to be clear, I wasn't saying you could use the same GMI info years later. I was only speaking to this specific scenario where the borrower came in once to request two separate loans. Even in the rare instances where a refinance is done at the same bank, we collect the GMI fresh for the refi rather than going back to the original even tho, as David pointed out above, we could.

Return to Top
#2140984 - 08/07/17 02:18 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
swiggles Offline
Power Poster
swiggles
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 7,333
I made the point earlier, but if I were to open the door for this, I would be opening Pandora's box and would likely end up with some violations when lenders try to take a shortcut and not gather GMI again when they should have.
_________________________
The more you sweat in training, the less you bleed in battle.......

Return to Top
#2140996 - 08/07/17 03:05 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
RR Joker Offline
10K Club
RR Joker
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 20,654
The Swamp
TR, You could for B, but I don't believe that same allowance works for a HMDA reportable 'repeat' loan. But then, I already said that, didn't I. Simultaneous requests are an entirely different thing, though.
_________________________
My opinion only. Not legal advice.

Say you'll haunt me - Stone Sour

Return to Top
#2141051 - 08/07/17 04:59 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
Truffle Royale Offline

10K Club
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 17,359
We're talking apples and oranges here.

OP said borrower came in to request two loans.
All I'm saying is that you don't have to ask them the GMI questions twice, the same way you didn't ask them for their home address twice.
You just copied the info on both application forms and had them sign them.

Done and done.

Return to Top
#2141085 - 08/07/17 06:41 PM Re: GMI on a different application Bec
RR Joker Offline
10K Club
RR Joker
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 20,654
The Swamp
Totally agree.

The reason I remarked again was due to this statement:

Even in the rare instances where a refinance is done at the same bank, we collect the GMI fresh for the refi rather than going back to the original even tho, as David pointed out above, we could.
_________________________
My opinion only. Not legal advice.

Say you'll haunt me - Stone Sour

Return to Top

Moderator:  SMQ, CRCM