Is there a simple answer for whether we report Total Loan Costs or Total Points and Fees?

Basically, total points and fees is going to be reported for non-TRID loans (which really means mobile home only loans WITHOUT land). TRID loans are going to report total loan costs.

Perfect! Thank you, Jay, I appreciate it sir! But it is just one or the other, right?

Yes, just one or the other (or neither, if not subject to TRID NOR ATR).

Here's a summary for Total Loan Costs, Points and Fees, Discount Points, Origination Charges and Lender Credits:
If a HMDA reportable loan is made and subject to the “ability to repay” (ATR) requirements you must report the total loan costs or the total points and fees. Report total loan costs if the loan is subject to ATR and the “integrated disclosure” (TRID) requirements. Report total points and fees if the loan is subject to ATR but not TRID.
Additionally, if a HMDA reportable loan is made and subject to TRID you must also report the discount points, origination charges and lender credits.

Hope that helps.

Am I correct in understanding that for construction to permanent loans, we would need to report total loan costs of both the construction and permanent phases, if the institution chooses to use the two disclosure option? Additionally, if the institution has two separate closings for their construction to permanent loans, wouldn't the institution need to use the total loan costs from both closing disclosures to report total loan costs on HMDA LAR?

Thanks

If the Bank has two closings, I believe you would just take the fees from the permanent financing. The Commentary to §1003.4(a)(17)(i) #1 tells us to report the total found within Section D on page two of the Closing Disclosure. It doesn't say to report it from two Closing Disclosures. Also, the July TRID rule tried to address the allocation of those fees on construction-permanent loans:
In the case of a construction-permanent loan that a creditor chooses to disclose as multiple transactions, the creditor must allocate to the construction transaction finance charges under § 1026.4 and points and fees under § 1026.32(b)(1) that would not be imposed but for the construction financing. If a creditor charges separate finance charges under § 1026.4 and points and fees under § 1026.32(b)(1) for the construction phase and the permanent phase, such fees and charges must be allocated to the phase for which they are charged.

Can someone point me to where in REG C for 2018 that states that a bank reports NA for total costs, points, fees and etc. if the loan is withdrawn, declined, incomplete, or any other reason that a loan would not close.

@Angela - This is in the Official Commentary for each of those data points. For example, see 12 CFR 1003.4(a)(18) Official Interpretation #1 -

ORIGINATION CHARGES—NOT APPLICABLE. Section 1003.4(a)(18) does not require financial institutions to report the total borrower-paid origination charges for applications, or for transactions not subject to Regulation Z, 12 CFR 1026.19(f), such as open-end lines of credit, reverse mortgages, or loans or lines of credit made primarily for business or commercial purposes. In these cases, a financial institution complies with § 1003.4(a)(18) by reporting that the requirement is not applicable to the transaction.

See how it says that reporting is not required for "applications." That is the phrase in each Official Interpretation that requires an origination to take place for an amount to be reported. If it doesn't close, then all you have is an application and as long as it is only in the application phase, then you report NA.

I agree. The loan must be close for these fields to be reported.

What about commercial loans subject to HMDA?

The fields mentioned above are "NA" for commercial loans as they are not subject to Reg Z and don't have a Closing Disclosure.

I am new to HMDA, so please be kind. How should Loan Costs and Points and Fees be reported on first lien Bond loans? They are exempt from ATR/QM but are subject to TRID. It seems weird to think that Loan Costs and Points and Fee would both be reported as "NA".

Origination charges and Total loan costs are reported, if subject to TRID.

Thank you Joker! I thought that since the loans were exempt from ATR/QM that the Loan Costs should be reported as "NA". So, if you will help me, not being subject to ATR/QM and being Exempt from ATR/QM are two different things?

This is what I have:

Total Loan costs: Do not round. Exact amounts, including cents. If there are no costs, but the
rule applies, $0 will be entered. If the rule does not apply, NA will be entered. Applies to loans
subject to TRID. [Line D‐ CD].

Total Points and Fees – Same as Total Loan Costs description. Applies to loan subject to
ATR, but not TRID. Should be Mobile home only loans. [These fees are the same as your
total HOEPA fees].

Origination Charges ‐ Same as above. [From Line A of the CD‐TRID loans only]. If no fee
was charged, report $0, Not NA or blank.

[keep in mind the above was geared towards the types of applicable loans my bank handles.]

This might help. It's from our HMDA Training Manual:'

Loan Costs, Points, Fees, Origination Charges and Lender Credits Summary:
If a HMDA reportable loan is made and subject to the “ability to repay” (ATR) requirements you must report the total loan costs or the total points and fees. Report total loan costs if the loan is subject to ATR and the “integrated disclosure” (TRID) requirements. Report total points and fees if the loan is subject to ATR but not TRID. Additionally, if a HMDA reportable loan is made and subject to TRID you must also report the discount points, origination charges and lender credits.

Thank you RR Joker and David! I appreciate the help! I now feel comfortable reporting NA for both Total Loan Costs and Point and Fees.

I'm a little confused. You say these loans [I've never heard of a consumer loan for this purpose] are subject to TRID. If they are, then Origination and Total Loan costs would either be a $amount of $0.00. Not NA. Am I missing something?

I am curious too. What the heck is a "first lien bond loan"?

You guys are making me nervous! The loan is subject to TRID but exempt from ATR/QM because they're Mass Housing loans first liens (housing finance agency loans).

Then you have a very valid question as the literal writing of the rule uses the word AND and not OR subject to Z, 19 and 43. I am trying to find something out on that.

I appreciate your help.

I come down on the side of reporting NA for both loan costs and points and fees in your circumstance Understudy. 99.5% of the time, if a HMDA loan is subject to TRID, it is also going to be subject to ATR, so i think that's why the "and" language is there...but in your case...the loan is NOT subject to both TRID and ATR (just TRID)....and then since the points and fees is simply a test of being subject to ATR, and you aren't, then NA is proper there too.

That's my point. What I'm wanting to try and find out for sure though is did the Bureau actually MEAN to cause that hiccup.

I'm not sure i really see a hiccup....it says "and".....

But why on earth would they want to differentiate on loans that actually have CD's. That makes zero logical sense.

[I know...logical...but I still want to know]

Differentiate what? Maybe they were carving out specifically for the type of situation Understudy is talking about. If only subject to TRID but not ATR, they were good with an NA....

Nevermind...i get what you are asking...i don't know why they would want it done that way...i only know how it reads.

Me too.

Please post if you find something that I've overlooked to misunderstood.

You are correct. NA on your scenario.

Such loans are not subject to 12 CFR 1026.43(c); therefore, you would report "N/A" for both fields, as has been noted before. I consider this pretty clear based on the heading for these categories in 12 CFR 1003.4(a)(17) -

For covered loans subject to Regulation Z, 12 CFR 1026.43(c), the following information:

Since the loan is not subject to 1026.43(c), then neither of the subcategories (Total Loan Costs/Total Points and Fees) are applicable.

David, thanks for that very succinct model.
I have been looking for anything that might be handled differently if it were a purchased loan.
So, if I am recording a purchased loan - MH, no land - would I still report only points and fees?

Thanks,

SMQ - Purchased loans (not purchase) are treated differently. Since the loan is not subject to TRID, but is subject to 1026.43 due to being dwelling (mobile home) secured, assuming the mobile home is functioning as collateral, then you look to the commentary for Points and Fees:

TOTAL POINTS AND FEES—NOT APPLICABLE.
Section 1003.4(a)(17)(ii) does not require financial institutions to report the total points and fees for transactions not subject to Regulation Z, 12 CFR 1026.43(c), such as open-end lines of credit, reverse mortgages, or loans or lines of credit made primarily for business or commercial purposes, or for applications or purchased covered loans. In these cases, a financial institution complies with § 1003.4(a)(17)(ii) by reporting that the requirement is not applicable to the transaction.

Because it is not subject to TRID, you would also use N/A for Origination Charges, Discount Points and Lender Credits.

To tag onto the last sentence/statement above (JCP), if a loan is originated under TRID, and the loan does not have Discount Points or Lender Credits, does the FI report NA or is the attribute left blank? MtgBot leaves the LAR blank, but QuestSoft triggers a V-edit until I confirm NA. Is NA the answer I want for a loan without Discount Points and Lender Credits?

Thanks!!

If there are no discount points or lender credits that field would be left blank.

I contacted QuestSoft about this and they stated that they will apply a future patch to fix this. Blank is correct.

I am so glad I asked. Thank you Dan and NSF.