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#2211189 - 04/16/19 02:09 PM Adding to List of Providers
mdog76 Offline
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If there is an increase in using a title company not on our providers list, at what point would or if they would need to be added to our list? Could this be an auditor/examiner criticism?

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#2211190 - 04/16/19 02:10 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
Skittles Online
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Is this title company chosen by the borrowers?
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#2211191 - 04/16/19 02:22 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
rlcarey Online
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I have the same question. If you have a provider on your written provider list, why would you add another one?
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#2211194 - 04/16/19 02:25 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
raitchjay Offline
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OK
I am taking the question to be something like this:

Provider A is on the bank's provider list.

85% of the time, borrowers are choosing unlisted Provider B and the OP is wondering if this means that the bank should stop listing Provider A and start listing Provider B. (OP...if that's not what you mean, you can correct me.) FWIW, my answer would still be no.
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#2211197 - 04/16/19 02:26 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
mdog76 Offline
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They aren't on our list so theoretically yes they are, but they are being used more often here lately.

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#2211198 - 04/16/19 02:30 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
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It is not a popularity contest. You use the provider for which you are comfortable regarding their fees. Nothing wrong with gaming the system a little either. As long as your service provider is available to the consumers to provide the services, having them pick someone not on your list gives you an unlimited tolerance.
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#2211211 - 04/16/19 03:51 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
mdog76 Offline
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In the spirit of "gaming the system" and for arguments sake, what would stop a bank from listing just one title company and letting the rest of the title companies in the area be unlimited therefore eliminating COC's for title fees or lender credits because the title company went up?

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#2211213 - 04/16/19 03:55 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
raitchjay Offline
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You are re-issuing LE's because the borrower doesn't choose your title provider? There's no reason to do that (in fact, there's no valid changed circumstance occurring...so you can't do that).

What you say though is exactly what banks do (without problem): List a provider you are comfortable with and if they choose a different one, head to unlimited tolerance land and simply show the title fees as "borrower shopped for" items on the CD.
Last edited by raitchjay; 04/16/19 03:56 PM.
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#2211214 - 04/16/19 03:58 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
mdog76 Offline
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Sorry if my question wasn't clear, but we don't do that. What I meant was eliminating COC's because title fees changed/increased or lender credits because title fees increased. This is just a hypothetical question at this point.

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#2211215 - 04/16/19 04:03 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
John Burnett Offline
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Clarification -- You can't issue a revised LE to reset estimates when there's no changed circumstance or other triggering event. That's true. But you can issue an informational LE with updated info at any time before the CloD is issued in the spirit of keeping the borrower current on costs and anticipated cash due at/from closing. But too many LEs is never a good idea and it's frowned on by the CFPB because it can result in info overload and consumer confusion.

So most banks issue the initial LE and only those revised LEs required to use changed circumstances and similar trigger events to adjust cost estimate bases and avoid tolerance violations. Some even avoid revised LEs for changed circumstances unless the potential tolerance violation is more than a significant amount.
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#2211220 - 04/16/19 04:25 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
raitchjay Offline
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mdog....if title fees from Provider B who wasn't on your provider list increase--it's a non-event, because it's unlimited tolerance. Or am i still not understanding what you're asking?
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#2211225 - 04/16/19 04:32 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
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going back to your original question, it's perfectly legit to have only one provider for any given service on your SSPL so no examiner is going to question it.
The SSPL is suppossed to line up with the fees you're showing on the LE so it would be impossible to corral every provider into using the same fee as you're showing. Therefore, you go with the one you would use if the bank were chosing.
The decision to add or switch a provider on your list is totally up to you. Is there something that would cause your bank use the provider more borrowers seem to be chosing of late over the one you currently would use? If so, then switch. If not and your bank is comfortable relying on the provider on the SSPL to do the work if the borrower opts not to chose, then leave it be.

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#2211243 - 04/16/19 05:59 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
mdog76 Offline
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Thanks for the input everyone. This was just a hypothetical that came to me. We actually have about 5 or 6 title companies on our provider list. If I was a title company, I wouldn't want to be a banks list.

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#2211244 - 04/16/19 06:02 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
raitchjay Offline
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Why not? What skin is it off the title company's back whether they're the provider on your list? I would think if anything, it might be appreciated because at least vaguely, the bank seems to be recommending that title company. At least in my little corner of the world, where we have 2 main title companies in town, the 1 that isn't in our list would probably be huffy if they knew that (they may know it already....not sure).
Last edited by raitchjay; 04/16/19 06:03 PM.
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#2211245 - 04/16/19 06:09 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
raitchjay Offline
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(I didn't mean that to sound short in any way...i'm just truly curious as to why you think that.)
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#2211249 - 04/16/19 06:22 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
mdog76 Offline
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No problem. If I was a title company and knew how the tolerances worked, I'd rather be left off the provider list and be able to be subject to unlimited tolerance (within reason). But if in a place with 2 or 3 title companies, I can see where huffy attitudes could arise by not being on a banks list. We are in a heavy tourist area with cabins everywhere (Sevier County, TN) and there are a lot of title companies to choose from.

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#2211253 - 04/16/19 06:28 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
raitchjay Offline
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Have to be a pretty shady title company to start basing prices on that........think they could get themselves in some pretty deep hot water if they tried that.
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#2211257 - 04/16/19 06:47 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
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So, mdog 76, if one title company is being chosen more lately, have you checked to see why? Are they offering some deal or kick back through real estate agents or something? Realtors aren't allowed to chose title companies either so I'd be checking to make sure my bank wasn't on the short end of a stinky stick.

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#2211267 - 04/16/19 07:12 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
rlcarey Online
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Originally Posted By mdog76
We actually have about 5 or 6 title companies on our provider list.


Wow - how in the world do you quote the fees correctly in Section C if you have six different answers for a specific fee?
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#2211309 - 04/17/19 03:13 AM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
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Betting it's a small town scenario where the competition necessitates everyone stay with the same basic prices and the bank can't afford to po any of the providers Community good will and all. Only one or two of the community banks we deal with still does this. Thankfully, the others have wised up and gone with only one on the SSPL. Or maybe the title companies wised up to their ability to charge whatever they want as long as they stay off the bank's SSPL. wink

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#2211333 - 04/17/19 02:17 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
RR Joker Offline
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I'm in small markets, but have historically only listed one provider per market. They all know how this works smile
Last edited by RR Joker; 04/17/19 02:18 PM.
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#2211357 - 04/17/19 03:40 PM Re: Adding to List of Providers mdog76
John Burnett Offline
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A title company is going to charge what it is going to charge whether it's on your list or not. They know they will be paid, and they don't really care whether the money is from the borrower's pocket or the bank's.
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