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#2217074 - 07/05/19 06:02 PM Referral vs Lead
Larry Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 91
While RESPA Section 8 prohibits paying for referrals, lenders can, and regularly do, pay for leads. Can someone explain the differences between them and why these differences matter from a regulatory perspective?

Thanks

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#2217076 - 07/05/19 06:25 PM Re: Referral vs Lead Larry
David Dickinson Offline
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David Dickinson
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Central City, NE
I'm aware of no difference. When it comes to RESPA Section 8 I believe they are synonymous. Look at §1024.14:

(b) No referral fees. No person shall give and no person shall accept any fee, kickback or other thing of value pursuant to any agreement or understanding, oral or otherwise, that business incident to or part of a settlement service involving a federally related mortgage loan shall be referred to any person. Any referral of a settlement service is not a compensable service, except as set forth in §1024.14(g)(1). A company may not pay any other company or the employees of any other company for the referral of settlement service business.

(f) Referral. (1) A referral includes any oral or written action directed to a person which has the effect of affirmatively influencing the selection by any person of a provider of a settlement service or business incident to or part of a settlement service when such person will pay for such settlement service or business incident thereto or pay a charge attributable in whole or in part to such settlement service or business.
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#2217204 - 07/09/19 01:14 PM Re: Referral vs Lead David Dickinson
Larry Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 91
How would RESPA consider a scenario where a lender purchases a list of consumer names with contact info (and possibly other attributes) from a third party for the purpose contacting those consumers about applying for a mortgage?

It was my view that the lender is purchasing leads rather than referrals, because they're paying for information that they will use to contact the consumer, which appears to be outside the definition of a referral. However, if the third party was providing the consumer with information in order for the consumer to contact the lender, then it would be a referral. Am I correct?

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#2217205 - 07/09/19 01:21 PM Re: Referral vs Lead Larry
rlcarey Online
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(and possibly other attributes) from a third party

Well that has to be further defined.

In that last scenario - what's in it for the third party to do this?
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#2217206 - 07/09/19 01:38 PM Re: Referral vs Lead Larry
Larry Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 91
The other attributes could be things such as whether the consumer is a home owner based on public records. I understand that the nature of other attributes could have FCRA or fair lending impacts, but didn't think they impact whether the information would be a referral.

In the last scenario, which I'd define as a referral, there could be various benefits to the referring party, and if they receive a thing of value from the lender then it would be a violation of Section 8.

But I'm trying to confirm whether the first scenario would be outside the definition of referral RESPA and what are the criteria that separate a referral from some other sort of information that a lender is allowed to pay for.

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#2217207 - 07/09/19 01:48 PM Re: Referral vs Lead Larry
rlcarey Online
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Galveston, TX
There is a lot of material out there regarding the difference between a lead and a referral.

In the last scenario, if you are paying someone to contact consumers in the hopes that that consumer will contact the bank and get a loan, I think that is called advertising.
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#2217208 - 07/09/19 01:54 PM Re: Referral vs Lead Larry
rlcarey Online
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rlcarey
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Galveston, TX
Just Google: respa lead generation
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#2217259 - 07/09/19 05:40 PM Re: Referral vs Lead Larry
Kimo in Idaho Offline
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Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 135
Larry,
I have recently had extensive battles with the FDIC on this issue (attorneys on both sides, big mess). At the very basic level it comes down to is there an endorsement in some way or not. As noted by others here it is much more complicated than that, to the point that it is difficult to discuss in this forum. Please PM me if you would like to discuss in greater detail.

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