Thread Options Tools
#32996 - 09/17/02 02:47 PM Finance Charge
Okieboy203 Offline
Member
Okieboy203
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 68
Would a "Title rundown/record" fee be counted as a finance charge?

Thank you

Return to Top
General Discussion
#32997 - 09/17/02 02:57 PM Re: Finance Charge
ahou Offline
Power Poster
ahou
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,094
I'm not familiar with the term "Title rundown/record" fee.

What type of loan, residential or consumer? (title for dwelling or car?) What is the purpose of this fee?
_________________________
Opinions are my own and not of my employer.

Return to Top
#32998 - 09/17/02 03:11 PM Re: Finance Charge
Dan Persfull Offline
10K Club
Dan Persfull
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 46,765
Bloomington, IN
If it is a real estate secured loan and the fee is a "title & Lien Search", it would not be a finance charge.

If it is a search for a vehicle title, such as a CarFax report, it would be a finance charge.
_________________________
The opinions expressed are mine and they are not to be taken as legal advice.

Return to Top
#32999 - 09/17/02 03:18 PM Re: Finance Charge
Okieboy203 Offline
Member
Okieboy203
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 68
They are already charging for a title search in addition to the title rundown fee. To me this would be a repeated charge and therfore a finance charge.

Return to Top
#33000 - 09/17/02 03:21 PM Re: Finance Charge
Dan Persfull Offline
10K Club
Dan Persfull
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 46,765
Bloomington, IN
Define the "Title Rundown/Record Fee" for us.
Last edited by dpersfull; 09/17/02 03:22 PM.
_________________________
The opinions expressed are mine and they are not to be taken as legal advice.

Return to Top
#33001 - 09/17/02 06:55 PM Re: Finance Charge
Tina A Sweet Offline
Diamond Poster
Tina A Sweet
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,033
Marysville, Ca.
I just called our Mortgage department and they said this is usually found on commercial property that has a very messy title. Let us know.
_________________________
Tina A Sweet-Williams
AVP Special Assets
mailto:tsweet@goldcountrynb.com

Return to Top
#33002 - 09/17/02 07:39 PM Re: Finance Charge
Dan Persfull Offline
10K Club
Dan Persfull
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 46,765
Bloomington, IN
Real-estate related fees. The following fees in a transaction secured by real property or in a residential mortgage transaction, if the fees are bona fide and reasonable in amount:
(i) Fees for title examination, abstract of title, title insurance, property survey, and similar purposes.

I’m still not sure what this "Title Rundown/Record Fee" is, but if it is a fee being charged in connection with the title examination to clear up “title or encumbrance” issues, then I will say it is not a finance charge.
_________________________
The opinions expressed are mine and they are not to be taken as legal advice.

Return to Top
#33003 - 09/18/02 04:52 PM Re: Finance Charge
ahou Offline
Power Poster
ahou
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,094
If it's a business purpose loan - it's exempt from Reg Z.
_________________________
Opinions are my own and not of my employer.

Return to Top
#33004 - 09/19/02 02:07 PM Re: Finance Charge
OnTheEdge Offline
Diamond Poster
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,677
SmallTown, USA
Commercial property is exempt from Reg Z!
_________________________
The opinions expressed are mine and do not necessarily reflect those of my employer.

Return to Top
#33005 - 09/19/02 02:37 PM Re: Finance Charge
Dan Persfull Offline
10K Club
Dan Persfull
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 46,765
Bloomington, IN
If this is a commercial/business loan, it is exempt from Reg. Z, however Okieboy has not confirmed if it is a business loan or not. Tina, said her mortgage dept. said this is a fee that is "usually" associated with commerical loans. Okieboy still has not defined what this fee, or the loan type is, so we are all "guessing" as to what his situation is.
_________________________
The opinions expressed are mine and they are not to be taken as legal advice.

Return to Top
#33006 - 09/19/02 02:58 PM Re: Finance Charge
Okieboy203 Offline
Member
Okieboy203
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 68
Sorry for the late reply. it is not a commercial or business type loan. We asked the closing agent for a defintion of the fee and we have nothing back yet.

Return to Top
#33007 - 09/19/02 03:16 PM Re: Finance Charge
Dan Persfull Offline
10K Club
Dan Persfull
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 46,765
Bloomington, IN
I suggest you read the commentary for 226.4. Still not knowing what the fee actually is, and speculating that it is probably a fee that would be charged in a similar cash transaction (in order to assure clear and transferable title), I am going to say that I do not think it is a finance charge.

Section 226.4--Finance Charge
4(a) Definition.
1. Charges in comparable cash transactions. Charges imposed uniformly in cash and credit transactions are not finance charges. In determining whether an item is a finance charge, the creditor should compare the credit transaction in question with a similar cash transaction. A creditor financing the sale of property or services may compare charges with those payable in a similar cash transaction by the seller of the property or service.
_________________________
The opinions expressed are mine and they are not to be taken as legal advice.

Return to Top
#33008 - 09/19/02 03:36 PM Re: Finance Charge
Tina A Sweet Offline
Diamond Poster
Tina A Sweet
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,033
Marysville, Ca.
I think also you should take into consideration if it could be used in a comparable cash transaction as defined by Reg Z, if so, it would not be a finance charge.
_________________________
Tina A Sweet-Williams
AVP Special Assets
mailto:tsweet@goldcountrynb.com

Return to Top