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#338663 - 03/25/05 06:37 PM Another Dress Code Violation
Tricia Offline
Gold Star
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 458
Smack dab in the middle of IL
Our employees, in protest for having to work today (Good Friday - in the past we have always been closed, but due to several factors, management decided to remain open today), took it upon themselves to wear jeans today. Our dress policy states that jeans are permitted on half day (Thursday and Saturday). Today is Friday. An employee was calling other employees this morning telling them to wear jeans today in protest for having to work. This really angers me. Upper management doesn't seem to want to do anything about it, just to let it go. I have mixed feelings about it. On one hand, I feel that if we let them get away with intentionally violating a bank policy, then they won't have or show any respect for management or bank policy. Or if we just let it go (like we didn't even notice), they will think what?!?! And on the other hand, if we confont them with the intentional violation and put a warning in their personnel file and maybe banning jeans altogether, what will that accomplish? I can see most of them tremble in their shoes...NOT! They would probably laugh. Can anyone help me!?!?! What would you do in this situation?
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Life is the willingness to be yourself and live in harmony with others. - Dr. Cherie Carter-Scott

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Human Resources
#338664 - 03/25/05 06:49 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
rlcarey Offline
10K Club
rlcarey
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 83,364
Galveston, TX
Send them home without pay to change their clothes. Write them up and make it impact their annual reviews. If you can prove that one person instigated the wholesale rebellion - fire them. They do not work in a democracy and have no right to dictate or ignore policy decisions established by management. They may think that they were being cute, but in a financial institution, the precedent of blatently ignoring policy presents undo risk, both from a financial aspect , but also possibly a physical security aspect that could endanger the lives of bank personnel. They can't pick and choose which policies they need to follow - regardless of the perceived impact.
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The opinions expressed here should not be construed to be those of my employer: PPDocs.com

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#338665 - 03/25/05 07:02 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
HRH Dawnie Offline
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HRH Dawnie
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 7,353
Anchorage Alaska
I would do the same thing Randy so wisely suggests. I've never worked in an institution where this sort of behaviour would be allowed. When we dress inappropriately here, we get sent home, no pay (ok the staff who are paid hourly) to change. If it happens three times they lose their job. The addition of the actions of the employee who called others warrents more severe punishment. If they didn't want to work on Good Friday they should take the day off as a vacation day.
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Dawn Coursey VP/CRA Queen

CRA Rating is in...Oh who cares...I'm home with the baby.

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#338666 - 03/25/05 07:46 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
beaten blind Offline
Gold Star
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 473
the Bat Cave
Heck - I'm just amazed your management allows jeans on half-days!!! My company requires pantyhose (not for men of course) any time the doors are open!!! Dresses are preferred but pant suits are allowed. Believe me, these employees you described would never survive here. They should be thankful for what they have rather than showing their behinds when they don't get what they want. Reminds me of my 10 year old!!!

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#338667 - 03/25/05 07:48 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
HappyGilmore Offline
10K Club
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 19,855
Pulling people out of the ditc...
And if you wanted to be punative, send them home for the remainder of the day without pay...or suspend them for a period of time without pay. You need to address it, at whatever level is your call. I think it will be very hard to prove if one employee instigated this, unless he called a member of management as well. All other proof is heresay and I would seriously look for hard proff before firing. Not to say that you couldn't chew them a new one and tell them that if there was proof they would be gone!
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Providing alternative truths since the invention of time

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#338668 - 03/25/05 07:50 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Elwood P. Dowd Offline
10K Club
Elwood P. Dowd
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 21,939
Next to Harvey
Ignore the rebellion, deal with them one at a time just as you would if only one of them did it. If someone asks, "What about everybody else?" say they don't need to worry about everyone else, you only hold them responsible for their actions.
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In this world you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant.

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#338669 - 03/25/05 08:27 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Tricia Offline
Gold Star
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 458
Smack dab in the middle of IL
Thank you for all the quick responses. I know that I can always count on my fellow BOLers for some good suggestions (and strong opinions).
And to Beaten Blind...we are a small family owned bank in a rural community. Our dress policy is relaxed in order to reflect our market area. Our farmers wouldn't be very comfortable around a suit and tie! But at the same time, we must present ourselves as professionals...I wouldn't want to see our loan officers in overalls!
_________________________
Life is the willingness to be yourself and live in harmony with others. - Dr. Cherie Carter-Scott

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#338670 - 03/25/05 09:19 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Anonymous
Unregistered

Here you are sent home to change with no pay... Dresses and pantyhose for women are a must every single day with no exceptions. They wouldn't even have made it in the door this morning if they worked here.

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#338671 - 03/25/05 09:24 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Anonymous
Unregistered

Heck...the last time I didn't wear panty hose to work they made me go home to get a pair. I am sure glad my wife did the wash.

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#338672 - 03/25/05 10:17 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
beaten blind Offline
Gold Star
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 473
the Bat Cave
Quote:

Heck...the last time I didn't wear panty hose to work they made me go home to get a pair. I am sure glad my wife did the wash.




Believe me, our dress code is as out dated as our wallpaper!!! But our HR director is militant about panty hose, suits, and even the style of shoes worn by both women and men! I'm not sure she has enough to do...

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#338673 - 03/25/05 10:22 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
HappyGilmore Offline
10K Club
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 19,855
Pulling people out of the ditc...
but you probably don't have issues like this either, do you?
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Providing alternative truths since the invention of time

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#338674 - 03/28/05 04:04 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
GenerousLife Offline
Diamond Poster
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,466
USA
Frenchie, how did it go?
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"No problem can withstand the assault of sustained thinking." ~ Voltaire
"Sustained thinking gives me a headache." ~Me

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#338675 - 03/28/05 05:14 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Beagles22 Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,626
State of confusion
Quote:

Here you are sent home to change with no pay... Dresses and pantyhose for women are a must every single day with no exceptions. They wouldn't even have made it in the door this morning if they worked here.




Dresses? No slacks with nylons? I wouldn't make it there.
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Going to church doesn't make you a christian any more that standing in your garage makes you a car.

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#338676 - 03/28/05 09:51 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
E.E.G.B Offline
Power Poster
E.E.G.B
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 6,726
the sandy shore
I'm curious how it ended up too!
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I disbelieved what he was saying so hard, I probably created an alternate universe where it wasn't true.

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#338677 - 03/29/05 05:05 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Tricia Offline
Gold Star
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 458
Smack dab in the middle of IL
No disciplinary action was taken. Although, I have drafted a new dress code policy that is alittle more detailed in what is considered appropriate business casual...such as not jeans, tennis shoes, T-shirts, etc and the fact that if their dress is not deemed appropriate by management, then they will be sent home immediately to change. I just passed out the proposed dress code to the employees for feedback and boy is there alot of whispering...so childish. The person who initiated the Jeans in Protest admitted to me today that it was her who mentioned that they should wear jeans in protest. I guess she didn't really mean anything by it (although I feel it was childish), she didn't mind working...so why the protest?!?!? With this new dress code, there will not be anymore violations overlooked...discipline will occur, you can count on it!
The employees here would have a hard time making it at some of your banks. I don't think they realize how good they have it here until someone complaints about someone or something, so we implement detailed written policies or implement changes to be more "fair". That is a whole other topic.
_________________________
Life is the willingness to be yourself and live in harmony with others. - Dr. Cherie Carter-Scott

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#338678 - 03/29/05 05:39 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Sunrider Offline
100 Club
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 133
Wow, RELAX! It is just clothes! It's not like they can in dressed like strippers, they just wanted to be comfortable.

Now if the rules allow for comfort, while still requiring some degree of "professional formality" (my bank is good at this) then the tellers need to appreciate that.
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By your command.

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#338679 - 03/29/05 05:41 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Princess Leia Offline
Diamond Poster
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,975
Alderaan
A manager of mine at a community bank once said:

If employees have enough time to grumble & complain, they don't have enough to do
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Duct tape is like the force: It has a light side and a dark side and it holds the universe together.

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#338680 - 03/29/05 06:04 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Tricia Offline
Gold Star
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 458
Smack dab in the middle of IL
Quote:


If employees have enough time to grumble & complain, they don't have enough to do




I have heard that too. Although, it seems like the ones that grumble the most here are the ones that have enough to do (sometimes they think too much). Go figure!
_________________________
Life is the willingness to be yourself and live in harmony with others. - Dr. Cherie Carter-Scott

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#338681 - 03/29/05 08:59 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Beagles22 Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,626
State of confusion
I am wearing a jean skirt and sandals, no nylons. What a scandal!! They haven't sent me home!
_________________________
Going to church doesn't make you a christian any more that standing in your garage makes you a car.

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#338682 - 03/29/05 09:23 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Princess Leia Offline
Diamond Poster
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,975
Alderaan
The community bank I worked at was very strict about the dress code - like what Frenchie is putting in place. Pantsuit or nylons with any dress/skirt, no opened toe shoes, no sleeveless shirts. Why is it that the tellers seemed to be the ones to always push the envelope. Causal day was Wednesday where we could wear khaki's/Dockers with a bank logo shirt or sweater. Never jeans except Saturday at the branch that only had driveup.

HR's motto was: if you question it or have to ask, it is not appropriate
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Duct tape is like the force: It has a light side and a dark side and it holds the universe together.

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#338683 - 03/29/05 09:56 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
doodle Offline
Platinum Poster
doodle
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 888
colorado
Quote:

Why is it that the tellers seemed to be the ones to always push the envelope.




From what I have seen, the tellers tend to be the youngest or the least experienced employees of the bank. (I know this is a huge generalization and there are several senior tellers at this bank. They are usually not the ones who push the envelope though.) They don't always comprehend what is "professional" and are usually trying to establish their own style in this environment. I've also found that since they tend to make much less than many other positions, they face the challenge of looking professional, on a budget, without much experience. I sympathize with them and try to be understanding while also trying to guide them.

Another thing I've noticed is that it is totally possible to be within the dress code and not look professional at all (unless you're required to wear suits all the time.) It's a very difficult thing to learn.
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You can never get enough of what you don't need to make you happy.~ Eric Hoffer

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#338684 - 03/29/05 10:07 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Beagles22 Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,626
State of confusion
I am not a teller. I am an underwriter and the compliance manager. Our Dress Code just isn't as strict in this small town. Most of our customers are not business people wearing suits and ties. For us my sandals and jean skirt (well below the knee) with a nice sweater is perfectly appropriate. I think it depends on your clients what is or is not appropriate and it should be outlined in your handbooks. If people don't look appropriate, send them home to change. I bet it doesn't happen often. I am, even today, more dressed up than others in slacks.
_________________________
Going to church doesn't make you a christian any more that standing in your garage makes you a car.

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#338685 - 03/30/05 01:24 AM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
HRH Dawnie Offline
Power Poster
HRH Dawnie
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 7,353
Anchorage Alaska
We'd send you home Beagle Anyone wearing sandels this time of year has to be nuts And nylons keep ya warm silly
_________________________
Dawn Coursey VP/CRA Queen

CRA Rating is in...Oh who cares...I'm home with the baby.

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#338686 - 03/30/05 01:53 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Beagles22 Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,626
State of confusion
Once it gets over 40 degrees in Wisconsin, I feel it's warm enough! I love bare feet. If I didn't have to wear shoes, I never would.
_________________________
Going to church doesn't make you a christian any more that standing in your garage makes you a car.

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#338687 - 03/30/05 02:31 PM Re: Another Dress Code Violation
Tricia Offline
Gold Star
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 458
Smack dab in the middle of IL
I don't think age as alot to do with it. I think it has more to do with a persons definition of business casual or what is considered professional. I have a 40 year old data processor who will wear a T-shirt with a puppy dog on it with jeans and tennis shoes on Saturdays. Even though she works in the "back" room, she still appears in the lobby to get the work to process several times during the day. This is one reason (besides the "jeans in protest" incident) why I updated and made our dress policy more specific. We are a small bank (like you Beagle Queen) in a small rural community, but there is a fine line between business casual and weekend casual (or in some cases, "going straight home to mow my yard casual"). We say to use good judgment and common sense, but that doesn't mean that everyone has the same level of good judgment and common sense...what might seem appropriate to one person may not seem appropriate to another. That is why there needs to be more specific guidelines in place.
_________________________
Life is the willingness to be yourself and live in harmony with others. - Dr. Cherie Carter-Scott

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