For those of you that don’t know the serial killer called BTK was sentenced to 175 years without parole. BTK is also a Christian and was active in his church for many years. So that leads me to a question I have trouble dealing with.

Can BTK be forgiven for his crimes by God? Is a statement of remorse all that's lacking for him to be forgiven by God and be considered a Christian? And if BTK killed and committed other crimes believing he would always be forgiven, can he still be forgiven? I have trouble reconciling that a good man who might be Hindu could not gain entrance to heaven but a man like BTK could if he simply repents and asks god forgiveness because he is a Christian. As far as I know the only sin that can keep a man out of heaven for good is rejection of god. So how could a man like BTK go to heaven, I understand that Gods mercy and love are infinate, but it just seems unfair.

Yeah, he may be forgiven, but you can bet the angels'll beat the sh*t out of him when he gets there.

I think it all depends on your beliefs and what you want to believe. Other religions believe completely different things. I believe that the repentance has to be sincere. If a person continually sins and repents, and it's sincere, I believe that person is forgiven. If there is just repentance because they think they have to, but they aren't sincere, forgiveness is not granted...

This a question to which you probably will not find a sufficient answer on BOL.

To gain insight from the perspective of Christianity, there are three books I suggest you read in no particular order. They have helped me with the kinds of questions you are asking.

1. Mere Christianity - C.S. Lewis
2. The Great Divorce - C.S. Lewis
3. The Ragamuffin Gospel - Brennan Manning

I thought of another one:

4. What's So Amazing About Grace? - Phillip Yancey

I will say this... God thinks He is God and His ways are not our ways. If you can come to the point where you believe and understand this simple truth, you will begin to start achieving some balance and perspective. (That's all I'm going to say. These are the kinds of questions to which you need to go out searching for answers, not have them delivered to your doorstep.)

Isn't that up to God?

Yeah, no man can write and be accurate as to what the big guy's gonna do. That's egotistical and sad.

God's grace is available to all who truly ask for it and repent of their sins. The Bible says it is up to us to seek forgiveness and repentness. There is only one sin that I have read about in the Bible that may not be forgiven this isn't it.

Just look at Paul, the writer of much of the New Testament, how many people did he kill before his encounter with Christ?

The BTK killer may have said that he is a christian, but I don't know how that can be and do what he did. I know may people who say they are christian, but their lives don't bear that out.

If they believe it, it must be true. I bet ya'll can't wait to hang out with Hitler when you get to heaven. He may have been wrong, but if he's right in his own mind I guess that makes it ok. Pretty sad stuff.

"As far as the East is from the West".

Thank God!

That Guy, ask yourself a question. Do you beleive in God? If the answer is no than the answer to your question is no as well. If there is no God, than God cannot forgive. If your answer is yes, then look around you at His creation, then deep inside yourself and ask yourself (because you already know the answer) "Does the God that created the universe require a person to be a Christian in order to receive His mercy and forgivness?"

listen to the voice inside you, you know the answer.

What I've seen on BTK, he has no remorse for what he's done. I saw the Dateline story on him, I think it was last week, and he talked about his crimes like it was nothing. He wanted the world to know what he did. It was like he was bragging about it. The only time he shed a tear was when he was talking about himself and being separated from his family.

So, with that attitude, unless he truly repents and seeks God's forgiveness from his heart, he will go to hell. All he cares about is his notariety. It doesn't seem to phase him the lives he's destroyed.

Amen, David

GOD has infinite ability to forgive, provided the party is truly contrite and asks for it. *I*, however, don't have a whole lot of elasticity and once you are on The List, it takes a WHOLE lot to get off it.

True repentance is asking God to forgive you of the "sin" you committed and turning away from it(a 360) and never committing it again. How can you ask God to forgive you and continue doing it? ... ya can't. Its not sincere. If you know it's wrong and ya continue... in my opinion (which we all have) you're sinning. But God is a forgiving God...and only He can make that judgement call.. we just have to take the Bible and live by it.

There was a guy in my high school class who tormented me mercilessly for all four years. He was the wildest guy our small town had ever known and I was the poster boy for the conservative group – right down to my crew cut and button down shirts. The things he did to me before, during and after P.E. classes would be considered criminal today.

Just before our 20th high school reunion I got a letter from his wife. They had accepted Christ as their personal Savior and he was looking forward to meeting me at the reunion so he could “restore” our relationship.

I skipped the 20th and 25th reunions because I couldn’t forgive him – even though I knew God had. Finally I arrived at the point where I was able to go to our 30th reunion to accept his apology – he wasn’t able to come. Our 35th was this year and I had a work conflict so I wasn’t able to go.

My point is this: forgiveness is one of those divine attributes that are much easier to debate than it is to understand or emulate. Maybe if we emulated it more we’d be less worried about understanding it.

ThatGuy, if you're sincere in trying to find an answer to your questions, I strongly suggest you take a look at the books that were suggested. You're only going to become more confused by reading the debate in this thread. IMHO, these kinds of debates are totally useless to you. People here mean well, but it's just people arguing and getting stuck on tangents and chasing down red herrings. You need some time to reflect on the issue away from our hype. You really should get one (or more) of the books.

Feel free to send me a PM and I'll be happy to talk with you one-on-one. (As I'm sure some of the other Christian folks here would be happy to do to.)

I thought I needed to clarify something. Don't worry about this being a sudden episode thats going to make me lose faith, this is just one of several questions I've had for years, and I still am faithful. BTK just brought one of these questions to the surface again. I trust everything works out fine when it's all said and done but I still question how now. I really am here to see how others have dealt with this sort of stuff personally. and if a debate starts then maybe thats good as it might make some look at thier faith again in a new light and learn more about themselves. I appreciate the offers for help, ad I do think I will look at some of those books listed.

forgot to sign in for the last post.

I don't think anyone is beyond God's reach. Consider Moses the murderer, David the adulterer, Paul the terrorist.

BTK is a very sick (spiritually) man. I believe that our Lord God would forgive him if he truly meant it. I just don't believe his sick mind is capable of a true asking of forgiveness. I just starting following this story about a week ago and was thoroughly digusted in how he used our Lord God's name in vain. Our prayers and concerns should be with all the family members who suffered and lost so
much. Those of us who are Christians will also pray BKT. He is the only one that can ask for TRUE forgiveness.

Can you image living with someone like that around you for most of your life. He was your neighbor, he went to your church, you see him in the store, at the park. And then all of sudden you see him on the news identified as a serial killer. That’s got to scar a person mentally forever. To find out that he had looked at you as a potential target, or been your friend, or been around your children. I can't imagine having to deal with something like that. I especially feel for his family, what ever they might have done wrong in life no one deserves to have to deal with that.