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#566950 - 06/13/06 11:28 PM Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Alien Offline
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I just got back from a trip to New Zealand, Australia, Fiji, Singapore, Malaysia and some other small nations in the Southern Hemisphere. Common theme? Every one of islamic belief in these countries hates the US - they don't care if you are Democrat, Republican, liberal, right wing, left wing or whatever - they don't even know what these mean - they hate us like I have never seen before. Every one of them wants to see the U.S destroyed. Period.
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#566951 - 06/13/06 11:41 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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Did you notice whether their hate was also directed at anyone else, or was it just Americans?

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#566952 - 06/14/06 01:23 AM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Blade Scrapper Offline
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I'm sure hatred of Jews was just assumed as being understood.
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#566953 - 06/14/06 12:04 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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You should have asked them where they would choose to live if they could choose to live anywhere...Most would say the US, despite their hatred.

I took a class in law school taught by a current US senator - he said the same thing about many countries regardless of religious background. Most people outside the US are jealous and say they hate the US...But when asked where they would choose to live if they could live anywhere, they always choose America.

Keep in mind that many undeveloped and 3rd world countries have state controlled media and news sources. Often they only get news about America that puts us in a negative light...

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#566954 - 06/14/06 01:10 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
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So are you saying their hatred of us is the right path, or that they are wrong?

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#566955 - 06/14/06 01:25 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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Tough to say. Hating our government and hating our people are two different things. I've traveled a fair bit overseas, and I've gotten along with everyone I've met. I've never had anyone say they hated Americans in particular, but I have had them criticize our government.

I spent some time in soviet-era Russia, and no one there said they hated Americans. If anything, most were surprised at how many similarities there were. The issues were always political...and sometime I agree.

Our government has backed some dogs since WWII for one reason or another. Noriega, Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden (for those of you with selective memories, prior to being the scourge of the planet, we supported Hussein in the Iran-Iraq war in the 80s, and we trained bin Laden and the Mujahaddin to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan) Batista in Cuba, Diem in Vietnam. We've picked poorly in our postwar history, and events in the last 10 years or so support it.

Our government has such a short-sighted view of international relations, that we tend only to look for immediate benfits rather than long term relationships. So in that respect, I can understand why the US is hated all over the world.

On the positive side - America is not only the most powerful economically and militarily, we are also the most generous. We send monetary, food, medical aid all over the world and are quick to respond to any international crisis - and we rarely get credit for it.

So like I said, I can understand it. I don't necessarily agree with it. Plus, criticizing the government is an American pasttime...Right up there with baseball.

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#566956 - 06/14/06 01:35 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Blade Scrapper Offline
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Quote:


Our government has backed some dogs since WWII for one reason or another. Noriega, Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden (for those of you with selective memories, prior to being the scourge of the planet, we supported Hussein in the Iran-Iraq war in the 80s, and we trained bin Laden and the Mujahaddin to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan) Batista in Cuba, Diem in Vietnam. We've picked poorly in our postwar history, and events in the last 10 years or so support it.





With the exception of Noriega, all of these examples are us fighting a greater evil, just as we supported stalinist russia in wwII. We don't always have a choice in who to support.
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#566957 - 06/14/06 01:36 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
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Quote:

Quote:


Our government has backed some dogs since WWII for one reason or another. Noriega, Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden (for those of you with selective memories, prior to being the scourge of the planet, we supported Hussein in the Iran-Iraq war in the 80s, and we trained bin Laden and the Mujahaddin to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan) Batista in Cuba, Diem in Vietnam. We've picked poorly in our postwar history, and events in the last 10 years or so support it.





With the exception of Noriega, all of these examples are us fighting a greater evil, just as we supported stalinist russia in wwII. We don't always have a choice in who to support.




Yes, but in the long run, was training Osama and providing him with weapons really the lesser of two evils?

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#566958 - 06/14/06 01:40 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
QuestionQuest Offline
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Bear in mind also that, particularly in the world of Islam, we are seen as the current leaders of the West. As such, we are indictable for all of the history of Islam's interaction with the West going back into the mists of time. When we are called crusaders, etc, that is not only a statement about current activities, but also a linkage back to the original crusades, the conflicts with the Byzantines, etc. In Islamic history, there tends not to be a strong distinction between nations. Byzantines, Franks, British, U.S, all tend to be bound up as part of the same tradition. As we are currently on top, we are currently the face of the perrenial "enemy of god". Just my thoughts.
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#566959 - 06/14/06 01:47 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Blade Scrapper Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:


Our government has backed some dogs since WWII for one reason or another. Noriega, Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden (for those of you with selective memories, prior to being the scourge of the planet, we supported Hussein in the Iran-Iraq war in the 80s, and we trained bin Laden and the Mujahaddin to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan) Batista in Cuba, Diem in Vietnam. We've picked poorly in our postwar history, and events in the last 10 years or so support it.





With the exception of Noriega, all of these examples are us fighting a greater evil, just as we supported stalinist russia in wwII. We don't always have a choice in who to support.




Yes, but in the long run, was training Osama and providing him with weapons really the lesser of two evils?


Don't get me wrong. I hope OBL meets the same fate as his recently deceased underling(is he still dead?) but communism has resulted in the murders of hundreds of millions. Islamofascism isn't there yet. its on its way, though.
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#566960 - 06/14/06 02:10 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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I too have been all over the world as of late and have two generalizations about islam, 1) alien is right and 2) I have not seen a non-radical muslim, they all seem to be jihadist.

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#566961 - 06/14/06 02:32 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Erl of Baltimore Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:


Our government has backed some dogs since WWII for one reason or another. Noriega, Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden (for those of you with selective memories, prior to being the scourge of the planet, we supported Hussein in the Iran-Iraq war in the 80s, and we trained bin Laden and the Mujahaddin to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan) Batista in Cuba, Diem in Vietnam. We've picked poorly in our postwar history, and events in the last 10 years or so support it.





With the exception of Noriega, all of these examples are us fighting a greater evil, just as we supported stalinist russia in wwII. We don't always have a choice in who to support.




Yes, but in the long run, was training Osama and providing him with weapons really the lesser of two evils?




It is the old adage,"the enemy of my enemy is my friend." Until he poops on me. Think back to WWII and our battle against the Japanese in the Vietnam area, we provided aid and resources to guess who? :drumroll: Ho Chi Minh. Talk about getting bitten in the butt after that. It was all the Frenchies fault anyway (couldn't fight their way out of a wet paperbag).
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#566962 - 06/14/06 04:34 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
doubledown21 Offline
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I've got news for you people, it's not just the muslim world that hates the american government. Try going to europe and saying bush is a good leader. even the average brits hate him, and they're about the only ally that he hasn't suceeded in alienating. in my experience, russians, french, africans, columbians, indonesians, they all hate our government.

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#566963 - 06/14/06 06:01 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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DD we said American's not American gov't. Don't start your bush bashing without reading first or your going to get schooled.

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#566964 - 06/14/06 06:15 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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bravo, bravo. Way to tell him. Typical liberals would use this type of discussion to spin it to a Bush bashing event. And let's get one thing straight here. All those people, they don't hate America. they hate what we stand for. Liberty, Freedom, Happiness, etc. they don't know any better. they live in poor areas and are taught to grow up idiolizing a certain "god" and are grown up taught to hate our way of life.
Quite honestly, I could care less if those clowns hate us. They live in a different world and mindset over there. Heck, I am sure if you start a forum on how many of us hate those people (i.e. muslims) I bet it would be the vast majority. It works both ways.

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#566965 - 06/14/06 06:20 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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Quote:

Common theme? Every one of islamic belief in these countries hates the US - they don't care if you are Democrat, Republican, liberal, right wing, left wing or whatever - they don't even know what these mean - they hate us like I have never seen before. Every one of them wants to see the U.S destroyed. Period.




I realize certain BOL liberals will think I'm a bigot by even asking this entirely legitimate question, but isn't what Alien experienced just further proof of the nature of Islam? It's a religion founded on hatred of all people and faiths that do not agree with it. It really is. This hatred has more to do with the nature of Islam than it does the actions of the United States. We're just the most current target in a tradition reaching back thousands of years. In order to truly understand the actions of those who adhere to Islam, you're obligated to look at any current issue in the context of history -- all the way back to Abraham, Ishmael, and Isaac.

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#566966 - 06/14/06 06:22 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
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Actually Islam is not founded on hatred of anyone, any more than Christianity is. Just as terrorists do horrible things in the name of their religion, so did Christians when they had the Spanish inquisition, (which of course noone expected), the crusades, etc. The religion is much closer to Christianity that you would suspect.

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#566967 - 06/14/06 06:24 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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Quote:

so did Christians when they had the Spanish inquisition, (which of course noone expected)




LOL! I love the Pythons!!!!

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#566968 - 06/14/06 06:53 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
QuestionQuest Offline
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I would agree, in that both are triumphalist religions. In fact, in the original Islamic formulation, Cristianity is considered an earlier, superceded revelation of the same religion.
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#566969 - 06/14/06 07:08 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
RandomName Offline
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Quote:

This hatred has more to do with the nature of Islam than it does the actions of the United States. We're just the most current target in a tradition reaching back thousands of years.




Well, not an Islamic tradition, since it arose in, what, the 600s AD?

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#566970 - 06/14/06 07:40 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Blade Scrapper Offline
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Quote:

I've got news for you people, it's not just the muslim world that hates the american government. Try going to europe and saying bush is a good leader. even the average brits hate him, and they're about the only ally that he hasn't suceeded in alienating. in my experience, russians, french, africans, columbians, indonesians, they all hate our government.




The hatred of the US Government by islamofascists was sufficient enough to plan 9/11 during the administration that was probably the friendliest to the mideast in their history. They hated us enough to fly planes into buildings during the previous administration. This has nothing to do with the current administration.
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#566971 - 06/14/06 09:39 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
Anonymous
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Quote:

Actually Islam is not founded on hatred of anyone, any more than Christianity is.




With all due respect, BF, you're mistaken. You need to take some time to read the Koran and you'll soon learn the truth. Go to the source, don't let others interpret for you.

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#566972 - 06/14/06 09:45 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
doubledown21 Offline
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DD we said American's not American gov't. Don't start your bush bashing without reading first or your going to get schooled.




I was just trying to bring your attention to the fact that the average people there don't hate the american people. When I was living in Russia I knew some really cool people from Iran who couldn't have cared less I was an American. They just hated the American government. And I have met some really good Muslims, by the way, far better than Christians like fred phelps. People shouldn't judge an entire religion by the extremists. Also I wasn't trying to start bush-bashing, that's just too easy. And by the way, speaking of schooling, i think you meant "you're" not "your"... maybe you need some educating... just a thought

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#566973 - 06/14/06 10:01 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
CubDave Offline
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I just got back from a trip to New Zealand, Australia, Fiji, Singapore, Malaysia and some other small nations in the Southern Hemisphere. Common theme? Every one of islamic belief in these countries hates the US - they don't care if you are Democrat, Republican, liberal, right wing, left wing or whatever - they don't even know what these mean - they hate us like I have never seen before. Every one of them wants to see the U.S destroyed. Period.


With all due respect, Alien, what was the purpose of this post. Personally, I could care less if everyone of Islamic faith hates the U.S. - for that matter, any person, regardless of faith, who hates a country or the people of a country enough to want them destroyed is of no consequence to me. I don't mean that disrespectfully, especially to you Alien, but I acknowledge our country and some of its leaders and populous are not very desirable, but that applies to any country or any faith or any segment of the population. At least in this country you're allowed to have differences, freedom of choice, and varied opinions.

I guess my point is that I won't lose sleep over a statement that all of Islam hates us and wants us destroyed. Whether it's true or not true doesn't matter. Whether there is a threat to our country and the people inhabiting our country certainly matters. But the fact that you state that all Islamic people you encountered hate us doesn't mater to me a bit.

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#566974 - 06/14/06 10:17 PM Re: Everyone of Islamic belief hates the US
CRAatBOK Offline

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If a French person ever read half of our threads he/she would go back to France and start a thread that would say "all Americans hates France". Do we? I for one do not. I may not agree with some of the choices the government makes but that does not mean I hate the country or the people. We talk about them being rude, well trust me, they don't have a corner on that market.

I have friends that just returned from France and they were "surprised" by how friendly everyone was, after all they had heard about the rudeness.

Yes there is a point to this thread, generalizations don't work. Not everybody hates the US but they probably find the people that think our country and its ways are better than everone elses, very arrogant.
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