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#581084 - 07/11/06 03:03 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
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Quote:
stuffed down his underwear
He had nothing "stuffed down his underwear". Don't be so gullible!
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#581085 - 07/11/06 03:11 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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mark, you can either acknowledge the substance of my comment or not. it doesn't matter to me. i am not casting facts in any particular light because i don't know that whole story. all i knew was that berger was cleared of whatever it was that he did.
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#581086 - 07/11/06 03:17 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Quote:
stuffed down his underwear
He had nothing "stuffed down his underwear". Don't be so gullible!
i should've guessed. typical conservative spin. just like the tacked-on statement to the rush limbaugh piece; even rush isn't conservative enough for some!
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#581087 - 07/11/06 03:17 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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10K Club
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 10,124
Way, way south.
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From MSNBC: Quote:
Berger Fries And Wilson Stews
By Michael Reagan
What a quandary the Democrats and their media allies are facing. Both have to explain the inexplicable how in just a matter of a week or two, top Kerry advisers Sandy Berger and Joseph C. Wilson IV have been immersed in muck and driven off the Kerry reservation.
Sandy Berger lifted a whole bunch of top secret documents, reportedly stuffed them in his pants and socks, misplaced some of the purloined items and says it was all an honest mistake.
Mr. Wilson now stands revealed to be the liar he falsely claimed President Bush to be. In both cases, the muck sticks to the Kerry campaign, which doesn't appear to be too choosy in picking advisers to their candidate.
OK, not his underwear, socks and pants, lol. Same thing.
_________________________
Giddy up.
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#581090 - 07/11/06 03:40 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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thank you, resident snopes-sters  alright, so he wasn't "cleared" but i don't think what he did (or more importantly DIDN'T DO) was what people are intimating. perhaps he was trying to cover something up, but WHY didn't he destroy the originals!!! i am just saying that berger is known as being a bit of a crazy intellectual and he maintains that he was taking work home. the fine was more of a technicality. my point was that he was doing his job. and i suggested that if rummy were taking things home, perhaps he would've arrived at a different conclusion about the WMDs in iraq. (but i don't think he wanted to  )
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#581091 - 07/11/06 03:47 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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10K Club
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 10,124
Way, way south.
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Ron, that is such a lame post. You're giving him "credit" for taking his work home when you have no actual idea what documents he had, and what he was going to do with him. A lot of presumptions on your part.
Regarding WMDs, didn't they just find documents that stated that SH actually did have some WMDs, and pretty much the entire world believed they were significant (even if found out later maybe they weren't nearly as potent as first believed)?
_________________________
Giddy up.
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#581092 - 07/11/06 04:06 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Ron, that is such a lame post. You're giving him "credit" for taking his work home when you have no actual idea what documents he had, and what he was going to do with him. A lot of presumptions on your part.
Regarding WMDs, didn't they just find documents that stated that SH actually did have some WMDs, and pretty much the entire world believed they were significant (even if found out later maybe they weren't nearly as potent as first believed)?
and your presumptions are cynical! so what! what id do know (and what you seem to have ignored) was that if his intentions were so malicious WHY DIDN"T HE TAKE AND DESTROY ORIGINALS?! that's like breaking into the louvre to steal mona lisa prints from their gift shop. at a certain point, you have to extrapolate and interpolate from what is known.
are you refering to the santorum "revelations", mark? we can start a side discussion about WMDs if you would like.
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#581093 - 07/11/06 04:16 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
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Ron, the point was there were variations in the versions he was destroying and the copies he was returning. Now, to my recollection, the archives staff has never been really clear about whether the original versions of all the copies that were destroyed are still available. But it sounds more than a little strange that he would sneak documents out and destroy particular versions. But, of course, you being the complete and total non-partisan that you are, I'm sure that any action taken by this advisor to the Kerry campaign is seen in the best possible light.
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#581095 - 07/11/06 04:26 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Ron, the point was there were variations in the versions he was destroying and the copies he was returning. Now, to my recollection, the archives staff has never been really clear about whether the original versions of all the copies that were destroyed are still available. But it sounds more than a little strange that he would sneak documents out and destroy particular versions. But, of course, you being the complete and total non-partisan that you are, I'm sure that any action taken by this advisor to the Kerry campaign is seen in the best possible light.
no, i like berger. that's my bias. it has nothing to do with kerry. kerry was my lesser of 2 evils.
i agree, it sounds fishy and he was punished for it, but those with more info on the case decided that he really wasn't doing anything THAT bad so they punished him with a technicality.
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#581096 - 07/11/06 04:28 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
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Quote:
Quote:
at a certain point, you have to extrapolate and interpolate from what is known.
By "extrapolate and interpolate" you mean "spin to fit your view of the world" right?
sounds about right
(you know what i meant, (_smart_))
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#581097 - 07/11/06 05:01 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
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Quote:
Now, to my recollection, the archives staff has never been really clear about whether the original versions of all the copies that were destroyed are still available.
Your recollection is a little off. Both the records administrators from the National Archives and the members of the 9/11 Commission were quite clear that they still had all of the originals of all versions of the documents. Berger just had copies.
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#581098 - 07/11/06 05:05 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
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It's possible. A source, please?
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#581099 - 07/11/06 05:09 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Gold Star
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 348
Oklahoma (transplanted)
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.............and if 'we' all had a chance at the office of presidency (who would want it?, we'd all be right all of the time and wouldn't make bad judgements...or choices at all, right? Yeah. Right.
_________________________
Ice Cream has no bones
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#581100 - 07/11/06 05:13 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
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Quote:
all i knew was that berger was cleared of whatever it was that he did.
If that is all you know, then why are you still posting here, your mental resources have been exhausted.
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#581101 - 07/11/06 05:29 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Quote:
all i knew was that berger was cleared of whatever it was that he did.
If that is all you know, then why are you still posting here, your mental resources have been exhausted.
your... head... has the candy shell
- tommy callahan
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#581102 - 07/11/06 05:33 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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Anonymous
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Quote:
It's possible. A source, please?
Here is a reprint of an article from the Wall Street Journal. (you can see the story on the WSJ website only if you have a subscription). Copies
" Archives spokeswoman Susan Cooper said officials there "are confident that there aren't any original documents missing in relation to this case." She said in most cases, Mr. Berger was given photocopies to review, and that in any event officials have accounted for all originals to which he had access.
That included all drafts of a so-called after-action report prepared by the White House and federal agencies in 2000 after the investigation into a foiled bombing plot aimed at the Millennium celebrations. That report and earlier drafts are at the center of allegations that Mr. Berger might have permanently removed some records from the archives. Some of the allegations have related to the possibility that drafts with handwritten notes on them may have disappeared, but Ms. Cooper said archives staff are confident those documents aren't missing either.
Daniel Marcus, general counsel of the 9/11 Commission, said the panel had been assured twice by the Justice Department that no originals were missing and that all of the material Mr. Berger had access to had been turned over to the commission. "We are told that the Justice Department is satisfied that we've seen everything that the archives saw," and "nothing was missing," he said."
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#581103 - 07/11/06 06:31 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
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10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
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Fair enough. My recollection was of some dispute as to whether he might have destroyed versions of drafts that had notes in the margins by those individuals who had reviewed them.
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#655806 - 12/21/06 06:44 PM
Re: FBI foils terror plot
Jokerman
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Joined: Nov 2003
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New report out today that pretty much blows away the whole "innocent mistake" meme. Hiding the stuff under a trailer outside the archives building is hard to reconcile with "oops!" http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/20/AR2006122001968.htmlI think the most interesting question about this whole situation is "why?!" None of this makes sense - why would someone of his stature take such incredible risks with his reputation? And, as to whether all versions and copies were recovered: The report states that in 2003, an official whose name was deleted informed the White House that the documents Berger reviewed during his first two visits -- in May and June of that year -- were so poorly organized and tracked that the archives "would never know what if any original documents were missing."
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