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#589621 - 07/27/06 06:14 PM Would you file a SAR for this?
Dip Offline
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Dip
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 6,298
San Diego, CA
We have a customer who keeps a very small account with us (so small that it goes negative on accassion) and doesn't perform a whole lot of activity on the account (average balance is less than $200 and a check will clear her account every now and then).

One day, this customer comes in and makes a deposit which inlcudes nearly $6000 in cash and then purchases $6000 in traveler's checks from her account (bada-bing, bada-boom ). When I see this account, this transaction shows up like a red flag. I ask the branch manager about what's going on, she asks the teller who did the transaction, and supposedly, the customer is getting a divorce and is trying to hid money from her husband during the process. Another employee is familiar with this customer and believes she is in fact getting a divorce.

Would you file a SAR based on the cash deposit being out of character for the customer???
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#589622 - 07/27/06 06:35 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
JRines Offline
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 47
Florida
Since you have 30days I would definitly wait to see if it happens again, if yes no questions I would file. If not, it is over 5k with a identified suspect with a transaction that does not fit the profile with a reasonable explenation. I do not considered hidding $ from their about to be a dirvocee reasonable. I also don't want to sound like defensive filing but I would file to protect the bank.

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#589623 - 07/27/06 07:04 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Dip Offline
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Dip
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San Diego, CA
anyone else have an opinion???
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#589624 - 07/27/06 07:20 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Anonymous
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I would watch the account to see if the cash deposits continue. Just because someone made a one time cash deposit and then buys travellers checks does not make this a suspicious transaction in my eyes. Now, if she continues doing this, I would say it's suspicious, but not just for a one time transaction. Just my opinion.

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#589625 - 07/27/06 07:28 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
devsfan Offline
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,927
NYC
I agree with PStalfort. A 1 time cash deposit of $6K would not, by itself, trigger a SAR to me. Last time I checked, hiding $$ from a spouse is not a crime, at least that's what my wife told me once.

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#589626 - 07/27/06 08:08 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Pinkie CRCM Offline
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Posts: 399
KY
Concur with PStalfort and devsfan. AND since it is close to the end of the day, what box on the SAR would you check? Smarter spouse?

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#589627 - 07/27/06 08:09 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Pinkie CRCM Offline
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KY
Sorry dip, I couldn't help myself!!

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#589628 - 07/27/06 08:46 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
ACBbank Offline
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New York City
I have to respectfully disagree. Given the amount of the transaction and what is in my opinion, activity that is without a doubt suspicious, I would file a SAR. In a regulatory environment with stricter rules and regulators looking more closely at SARS, at least in NY, I would file.
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#589629 - 07/27/06 09:08 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Dip Offline
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Dip
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San Diego, CA
the thing is, if she thinks she can hide traveller's checks, couldnt she also hide cash? it just seems weird but at the same time, i dont know hwo i woudl fill in the narrative on the SAR. i will just keep an eye out...if she does it just one more time, i will file then.
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#589630 - 07/28/06 12:21 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Hrothgar Geiger Offline
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Hrothgar Geiger
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Jersey Shore
Quote:

the thing is, if she thinks she can hide traveller's checks, couldnt she also hide cash? it just seems weird but at the same time, i dont know hwo i woudl fill in the narrative on the SAR. i will just keep an eye out...if she does it just one more time, i will file then.




Technically, you don't have to hide the traveller's checks.
You just have to hide the numbers.
If you record the numbers, you could burn or shred the checks and simply ask for them to be replaced at a later date. Of course, that would be wrong....

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#589631 - 07/31/06 05:54 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
02bonne Offline
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Posts: 620
Quote:

I have to respectfully disagree. Given the amount of the transaction and what is in my opinion, activity that is without a doubt suspicious, I would file a SAR. In a regulatory environment with stricter rules and regulators looking more closely at SARS, at least in NY, I would file.




I agree and would file one. It's over the threshold and from a practical standpoint is obviously suspicious enough to warrant your inquiry. I would be on the safe side and file.

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#589632 - 07/31/06 06:31 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
CrashDavis Offline
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 283
My question, why did she deposit the cash into her account first and then purchase the traveler cheques. Why didn't she just purchase the traveler' cheques with the cash and not place in account first.

I would file a SAR?

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#589633 - 07/31/06 06:41 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Dip Offline
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Dip
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San Diego, CA
Quote:

My question, why did she deposit the cash into her account first and then purchase the traveler cheques. Why didn't she just purchase the traveler' cheques with the cash and not place in account first.

I would file a SAR?




to avoid having to fill out a monetary instrument log. this would not be considered structuring since the fed/fincen/whoever allows banks to do this for deposit account holders to avoid extra burden.
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#589634 - 07/31/06 09:25 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
John Burnett Offline
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Cape Cod
But you need to record the information normally required on a monetary purchase log anyhow, since the cash was used immediately for a monetary instrument purchase.
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#589635 - 08/01/06 12:56 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
ACBbank Offline
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New York City
It only seems logical that if there is this much debate, the potential for this activity being suspicious is evident. In compliance, as I am sure we all know, it is better to be safe than sorry. I would file the SAR.
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#589636 - 08/01/06 04:08 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Dip Offline
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Dip
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San Diego, CA
Quote:

It only seems logical that if there is this much debate, the potential for this activity being suspicious is evident. In compliance, as I am sure we all know, it is better to be safe than sorry. I would file the SAR.




...unless I document my decision to not file and include what will induce me to file in the future. ie: decide nto to file based on one ocurrence (one time ocureence for activity in question is not suspicious)...will monitor account for the next month and file a SAR for any additional uncharacteristic customer behavior...
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#589637 - 08/01/06 06:36 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
ACBbank Offline
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ACBbank
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New York City
Im not following the train of thought of here. Let me see if I understand this. A one time activity, which would appear to be suspicious, as you posted here for advice on it, is not reportable as long as it doesn't happen again? It appears, at least to me your basing this decision to file or not a SAR on whether a future activity occurs, which will then make this current activity go from "one occurence" to suspicious. I have to disagree on the "one time" theory. However, there is some degree of debate on this topic in Banking, and feel free to file or not file.
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#589638 - 08/01/06 08:06 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
MagicCity Offline

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Fort Lauderdale, Florida
I definitely would not file on a one time transaction.
So unless you know for a fact that the money came from illegal sources - I think it is too defensive a filing.
IMHO.

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#589639 - 08/01/06 08:29 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
ACBbank Offline
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New York City
This is taken verbatim from the updated BSA/AML Examination Mnual recently released:

"The SAR should describe, as fully as possible, why the activity or transaction is unusual for the customer, considering the types of products and services offered by the filing bank's industry, and drawing any applicable contrasts with the nature and normally expected activities of similar customers."

I believe the key phrase is the end of the paragraph. Unless I am misunderstanding Dips original post, I belive Dip already states that this type of transaction is unusual for this particluar customer. Therefore, a SAR would be applicable. Sometimes, a defensive filing is called for, at least IMHO.
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#589640 - 08/01/06 08:51 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Dip Offline
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Dip
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San Diego, CA
good thing i have 30 days to file i think i'll check this post at the end of the 30 days and coutn up the files vs non-files and decide from there. i'll even print the thread out and include with the documentation, LOL!!!!
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#589641 - 08/02/06 02:40 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
ACBbank Offline
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New York City
Ah the 30 day rule. One of the few things we have in our favor. I like the idea dip
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#589642 - 08/02/06 02:49 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
YosemiteSamIAm Offline
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Posts: 2,795
Guess
Survey says...file!
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#589643 - 08/02/06 05:31 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
Becka Marr Offline
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Becka Marr
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Quote:

We have a customer who keeps a very small account with us (so small that it goes negative on accassion) and doesn't perform a whole lot of activity on the account (average balance is less than $200 and a check will clear her account every now and then).




Where does someone with an average balance of $200 get $6000 cash?

The transaction did not really put you in a risk position; and I agree it would be defensive, but would probably still file the SAR.

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#589644 - 08/03/06 03:34 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
MagicCity Offline

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MagicCity
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Fort Lauderdale, Florida
The person could have sold a car.
Sold other legal stuff.
Won money at the track.
Been given a gift.
Won a lottery.
Filing on one transaction is too defensive.
IMHO.

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#589645 - 08/03/06 03:44 PM Re: Would you file a SAR for this?
ACBbank Offline
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ACBbank
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Posts: 4,344
New York City
That is circular reasoning. Point being, you don't know where the money came from. It could also be from something illegal. I won't go on to list the numerous possibilities as you did, but for a jump to 6M from $200.00, I will be filing a SAR unless I can document where that money came from. Again, the reg. I copied and pasted is specific in terms of "unusual transaction." I feel this fits that defintion.
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