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#604503 - 08/24/06 06:34 PM Re: FDA Approval
MichelleDawn Offline
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MichelleDawn
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To all those taking these black and white stands on abortion... I don't know if any of you have teenage daughters, but imagine this scenario...

Your 15 year old daughter comes home and tells you she's pregnant -- happened at a party and she doesn't even know who the guy is. She's your youngest and your plans were that she attend college while you and your wife retire to your beach house. So now you say, "don't worry honey, have the baby and your mother and I will put our lives on permanent hold so we can raise your's and whatshisname's baby while you finish school and figure out your life. Because after all abortion would be taking a life and it is ALWAYS the wrong thing to do.

Easy to say -- not so easy to do.



No, but I think it would be easier to say to her, "Your mother and I will support you and help you through this pregnancy. Then for the best interest of you, the baby, and our entire family, we should provide that baby for adoption into a loving, committed, two-parent (mother and father, not mother and mother or father and father) household. Abortion should not be an option for you because abortion is the wrong thing in the eyes of God."

And for what it's worth, I have two daughters, 17 and 23.




That's fine for your daughters, but if I had daughters I certainly wouldn't want them getting that message.




We raised out son with the message that abortion is wrong. It should not be a form of birth control. We just don't agree with it. Our opinion, nothing more, nothing less. However, I would not outlaw abortion. This pill I think is a good thing. If my daughter got pregnant, I would support her in any and every way I could. But if she was date raped, I would want this available to her.




I agree, it shouldn't be used as birth control, but I don't think any one group should be determining what a person should hear. Anyone can say what they want in their own house, but when these things get into schools and clinics I have issues. I would want to present ALL the options and talk about each of them before making the decision.
Last edited by Sweetpeas; 08/24/06 06:38 PM.
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#604504 - 08/24/06 06:37 PM Re: FDA Approval
rainman Offline
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Straw, it's the response to Q 3. Here's what it says:

3. How does Plan B work?

Plan B works like other birth control pills to prevent pregnancy. Plan B acts primarily by stopping the release of an egg from the ovary (ovulation). It may prevent the union of sperm and egg (fertilization). If fertilization does occur, Plan B may prevent a fertilized egg from attaching to the womb (implantation) . If a fertilized egg is implanted prior to taking Plan B, Plan B will not work.


It looks like they have 2 Q&A's (at least); the answer to this question was revised for the most recent version. I don't know why.
Last edited by rainman; 08/24/06 06:40 PM.
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#604505 - 08/24/06 06:38 PM Re: FDA Approval
straw Offline
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that is from the Q & A issued on the denial. Please look at the Q & a dated today. Questions 3 & 4 are different and read as follows:

"3. What is Plan B?

Plan B is emergency contraception, a backup method to birth control. It is in the form of two levonorgestrel pills (0.75 mg in each pill) that are taken by mouth after a contraceptive fails or after unprotected sex. Levonorgestrel is a synthetic hormone used in birth control pills for over 35 years. Plan B can reduce the chances of a woman becoming pregnant when taken as directed if she has had unprotected sex. Prior to this action, Plan B was available only by prescription.

4. How does Plan B work?

Plan B works like other oral birth control pills to prevent pregnancy. Plan B acts primarily by stopping the release of an egg from the ovary (ovulation). It may prevent the union of sperm and egg (fertilization)."

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#604506 - 08/24/06 06:41 PM Re: FDA Approval
rainman Offline
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yeah, I figured that out after I had already posted. . . sorry.
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#604507 - 08/24/06 06:39 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

To all those taking these black and white stands on abortion... I don't know if any of you have teenage daughters, but imagine this scenario...

Your 15 year old daughter comes home and tells you she's pregnant -- happened at a party and she doesn't even know who the guy is. She's your youngest and your plans were that she attend college while you and your wife retire to your beach house. So now you say, "don't worry honey, have the baby and your mother and I will put our lives on permanent hold so we can raise your's and whatshisname's baby while you finish school and figure out your life. Because after all abortion would be taking a life and it is ALWAYS the wrong thing to do.

Easy to say -- not so easy to do.



No, but I think it would be easier to say to her, "Your mother and I will support you and help you through this pregnancy. Then for the best interest of you, the baby, and our entire family, we should provide that baby for adoption into a loving, committed, two-parent (mother and father, not mother and mother or father and father) household. Abortion should not be an option for you because abortion is the wrong thing in the eyes of God."

And for what it's worth, I have two daughters, 17 and 23.




That's fine for your daughters, but if I had daughters I certainly wouldn't want them getting that message.




We raised out son with the message that abortion is wrong. It should not be a form of birth control. We just don't agree with it. Our opinion, nothing more, nothing less. However, I would not outlaw abortion. This pill I think is a good thing. If my daughter got pregnant, I would support her in any and every way I could. But if she was date raped, I would want this available to her.




I agree, it shouldn't be used as birth control, but I don't think any one group should be determining what a person should hear. I would want to present ALL the options and talk about each of them before making the decision.




I agree with you, Sweetpeas (oh, I guess I'm not supposed to say that, am I). I am much more pro-life than pro-choice, but every case has to be determinded individually. This pill makes sense. Plain and Simple!

Shhhhh

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#604508 - 08/24/06 06:39 PM Re: FDA Approval
Jokerman Offline
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Quote:

What gives?




Apparently they have changed their story about how it works.

Interestingly, its manufacturer has not: http://www.go2planb.com/ForConsumers/AboutPlanB/HowItWorks.aspx

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#604509 - 08/24/06 06:41 PM Re: FDA Approval
MichelleDawn Offline
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MichelleDawn
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,994
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

To all those taking these black and white stands on abortion... I don't know if any of you have teenage daughters, but imagine this scenario...

Your 15 year old daughter comes home and tells you she's pregnant -- happened at a party and she doesn't even know who the guy is. She's your youngest and your plans were that she attend college while you and your wife retire to your beach house. So now you say, "don't worry honey, have the baby and your mother and I will put our lives on permanent hold so we can raise your's and whatshisname's baby while you finish school and figure out your life. Because after all abortion would be taking a life and it is ALWAYS the wrong thing to do.

Easy to say -- not so easy to do.



No, but I think it would be easier to say to her, "Your mother and I will support you and help you through this pregnancy. Then for the best interest of you, the baby, and our entire family, we should provide that baby for adoption into a loving, committed, two-parent (mother and father, not mother and mother or father and father) household. Abortion should not be an option for you because abortion is the wrong thing in the eyes of God."

And for what it's worth, I have two daughters, 17 and 23.




That's fine for your daughters, but if I had daughters I certainly wouldn't want them getting that message.




We raised out son with the message that abortion is wrong. It should not be a form of birth control. We just don't agree with it. Our opinion, nothing more, nothing less. However, I would not outlaw abortion. This pill I think is a good thing. If my daughter got pregnant, I would support her in any and every way I could. But if she was date raped, I would want this available to her.




I agree, it shouldn't be used as birth control, but I don't think any one group should be determining what a person should hear. I would want to present ALL the options and talk about each of them before making the decision.




I agree with you, Sweetpeas (oh, I guess I'm not supposed to say that, am I). I am much more pro-life than pro-choice, but every case has to be determinded individually. This pill makes sense. Plain and Simple!

Shhhhh




Prepare to be flogged for agreeing. God have mercy on your soul.
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#604510 - 08/24/06 06:45 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
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Prepare to be flogged for agreeing. God have mercy on your soul.






Shhh

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#604511 - 08/24/06 06:47 PM Re: FDA Approval
Jokerman Offline
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Quote:

Interestingly, its manufacturer has not...




In fact, here's how they put it: "Plan BŪ works like a regular birth control pill. It prevents pregnancy mainly by stopping the release of an egg from the ovary, and may also prevent the fertilization of an egg (the uniting of sperm with the egg). Plan BŪ may also work by preventing it from attaching to the uterus (womb)."

It? What is "it"? Why would they use a pronoun when they have not already referred to what "it" is?

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#604512 - 08/24/06 06:50 PM Re: FDA Approval
straw Offline
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straw
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Well I was wondering if the FDA had included the original comment for political reasons. Looks like the comment was deleting for political reasons.

I was wondering what all the hoopla was over the this, since I thought the drug did not have any affect on embryo.
Now I understand the fuss.

Very interesting.

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#604513 - 08/24/06 06:55 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
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since I thought the drug did not have any affect on embryo.



technically it doesn't. it doesn't allow integration into the uterus. it doesn't do anything the fertilized egg itself.

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#604514 - 08/24/06 06:57 PM Re: FDA Approval
straw Offline
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straw
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I am sorry; let me choose my words more carefully.

I understand the hoopla now that I know that it may prevent a fertilized egg from implanting into the uterus, which makes it much more like RU-486 than I realized.

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#604515 - 08/24/06 07:04 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
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Quote:

I am sorry; let me choose my words more carefully.

I understand the hoopla now that I know that it may prevent a fertilized egg from implanting into the uterus, which makes it much more like RU-486 than I realized.



much better

are they forcing people to take RU486 like they are with plan b?

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#604516 - 08/24/06 07:13 PM Re: FDA Approval
Dip Offline
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San Diego, CA
my friend took this pill once (got it from planned parent hood after having an abortion).

it makes you super sick to your stomach--cramping, nausea, vomiting. it wiped her out for an entire day. she said after going through it, she'd make sure she wouldnt have to take another pill. so, i say it's a good idea to make it available.
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#604517 - 08/24/06 07:44 PM Re: FDA Approval
Jokerman Offline
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are they forcing people to take RU486 like they are with plan b?




Ron, you're of course very clever ::pats on head:: but intentionally ignoring the problems that people who value the sanctity of life have with this doesn't do much for that enlightened discussion you're always seeking.

Do the embryos get a say in whether or not someone takes this?

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#604518 - 08/24/06 07:52 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
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Quote:

Do the embryos get a say in whether or not someone takes this?



do they have the ability to have a say?

hey, we have roe v wade. when that changes, let me know. until then, i don't see anybody forcing anybody to use this or any other abortion-related measure.

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#604519 - 08/24/06 07:53 PM Re: FDA Approval
rainman Offline
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hey, we have roe v wade.




I thought this was a discussion about moral issues, not legal standards. Last I knew, we were free to hold different moral views about human life than those expressed by the Roe court.
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#604520 - 08/24/06 07:55 PM Re: FDA Approval
RVFlyboy Offline
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Soaring over Georgia
Quote:

Quote:

Do the embryos get a say in whether or not someone takes this?



do they have the ability to have a say?

hey, we have roe v wade. when that changes, let me know. until then, i don't see anybody forcing anybody to use this or any other abortion-related measure.



You're being disingenuous with this tack. No one here is implying that anyone is being forced to take this. Just because someone says they believe something is wrong doesn't mean that anything is being forced on anyone.

If I say that I think it is wrong for the local Little League to schedule ball games on Sunday morning because that's when kids should be in church with their parents, does that mean I'm really stating that I think my kids and those of everyone else are being forced to play Little League or being forced to play on Sunday?
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#604521 - 08/24/06 07:57 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
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Quote:

people who value the sanctity of life



and don't even go down that road with me. aka DP

if you are going to give me a biblical rationale for this inconsistency, i think you know where i am going to go.

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#604522 - 08/24/06 07:57 PM Re: FDA Approval
Jokerman Offline
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Quote:

my friend took this pill once (got it from planned parent hood after having an abortion).

it makes you super sick to your stomach--cramping, nausea, vomiting. it wiped her out for an entire day. she said after going through it, she'd make sure she wouldnt have to take another pill. so, i say it's a good idea to make it available.




(a) Yeah, that sounds rough - not quite as bad as ceasing to exist, though.

(b) I'm not sure I understand the logic. Your friend terminated an unwanted pregnancy, then received this product, which she took later to terminate or prevent another unwanted pregnancy. After taking this product, she had a hysterectomy/tubes tied/prescription filled for birth control, in order to avoid taking it again. She did so because of the side effects.

First, isn't it odd that having the traditional abortion itself did not provide a similar motivation? Second, you think that it is a good thing that this is available because of the uncomfortable side effects, not because it is effective at ending/preventing pregnancies?

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#604523 - 08/24/06 08:00 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
Unregistered

Quote:

Quote:

hey, we have roe v wade.




I thought this was a discussion about moral issues, not legal standards. Last I knew, we were free to hold different moral views about human life than those expressed by the Roe court.



of course you are. people morally-opposed to this and people not morally-opposed to this BOTH do not have to use it. you would rather them not have the option.

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#604524 - 08/24/06 07:59 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
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I was raised Very Conservative, Very Roman Catholic. Throughout 12 years of Catholic school, we were taught that "You have a day to be born, and a day to die". I'm not trying to fan the flames here, but could these 'pregnancies' not be meant to be born?

Shhh

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#604525 - 08/24/06 08:02 PM Re: FDA Approval
Jokerman Offline
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and don't even go down that road with me. aka DP




I don't care to go down any road with you. It amazes me that you care more about murderers than innocent human life, but that's your position and you are the one that has to justify it.

Quote:

if you are going to give me a biblical rationale for this inconsistency, i think you know where i am going to go.




I think that where you're going is between you and the Lord.

I don't know why anyone would try to give you a Biblical justification for anything, since you do not respect that as a source of authority. However, it is very sad that in today's America, there are people who need it to be justified to them that innocent life ought to be protected.

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#604526 - 08/24/06 08:06 PM Re: FDA Approval
Anonymous
Unregistered

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Do the embryos get a say in whether or not someone takes this?



do they have the ability to have a say?

hey, we have roe v wade. when that changes, let me know. until then, i don't see anybody forcing anybody to use this or any other abortion-related measure.



You're being disingenuous with this tack. No one here is implying that anyone is being forced to take this. Just because someone says they believe something is wrong doesn't mean that anything is being forced on anyone.

If I say that I think it is wrong for the local Little League to schedule ball games on Sunday morning because that's when kids should be in church with their parents, does that mean I'm really stating that I think my kids and those of everyone else are being forced to play Little League or being forced to play on Sunday?



i wasn't being disingenuous. j used the "what would the embryoes say" strawman. i set the record straight.

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#604527 - 08/24/06 08:04 PM Re: FDA Approval
Jokerman Offline
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we were taught that "You have a day to be born, and a day to die". I'm not trying to fan the flames here, but could these 'pregnancies' not be meant to be born?




Is that the position you take towards the BTK killer's actions? Perhaps those people were meant to die, and therefore his actions are acceptable?

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