Thread Options 
|
#606904 - 09/05/06 12:50 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 10,395
Jersey Shore
|
Quote:
When will the right apologize FOR GWB and Rove???
If you catch them after a few drinks, they get all weepy, and mumble, "Awwww man, we had no effing idea it would turn out like that...."
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606905 - 09/05/06 01:01 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Power Poster
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,350
The he11 of suburbia
|
Quote:
Quote:
When will the right apologize FOR GWB and Rove???
If you catch them after a few drinks, they get all weepy, and mumble, "Awwww man, we had no effing idea it would turn out like that...."
I'm sure in the 1920's, a lot of people thought electing Hitler was a good idea too...
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606907 - 09/05/06 01:11 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 10,124
Way, way south.
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
When will the right apologize FOR GWB and Rove???
If you catch them after a few drinks, they get all weepy, and mumble, "Awwww man, we had no effing idea it would turn out like that...."
I'm sure in the 1920's, a lot of people thought electing Hitler was a good idea too...
Wow. In my opinion, you're insane.
_________________________
Giddy up.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606908 - 09/05/06 01:14 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Power Poster
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,350
The he11 of suburbia
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
When will the right apologize FOR GWB and Rove???
If you catch them after a few drinks, they get all weepy, and mumble, "Awwww man, we had no effing idea it would turn out like that...."
I'm sure in the 1920's, a lot of people thought electing Hitler was a good idea too...
tsk, tsk, tsk ... you are going to get some angry posts for that comment. 
It wasn't a direct comparison of GWB to Hitler as individuals. However each was originally elected by the people, each turned out to be horribly different than what the electorate envisioned, and each had a hold over people such that they kept him in office against their own best interests. Each one "stayed the course" even when it became clear the course was disasterous. Each was hard-headed and did not take advice well.
We should thank God however that our democracy is strong enough to endure this. I firmly believe that if Bush/Rove/Cheney thought they had a chance, they would seek to suspend our representative government and establish a dictatorship (after all, don't we need a strong leader to fight the fascist terror threat??  )
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606909 - 09/05/06 01:22 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Power Poster
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,994
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
When will the right apologize FOR GWB and Rove???
If you catch them after a few drinks, they get all weepy, and mumble, "Awwww man, we had no effing idea it would turn out like that...."
I'm sure in the 1920's, a lot of people thought electing Hitler was a good idea too...
tsk, tsk, tsk ... you are going to get some angry posts for that comment.
It wasn't a direct comparison of GWB to Hitler as individuals. However each was originally elected by the people, each turned out to be horribly different than what the electorate envisioned, and each had a hold over people such that they kept him in office against their own best interests. Each one "stayed the course" even when it became clear the course was disasterous. Each was hard-headed and did not take advice well.
We should thank God however that our democracy is strong enough to endure this. I firmly believe that if Bush/Rove/Cheney thought they had a chance, they would seek to suspend our representative government and establish a dictatorship (after all, don't we need a strong leader to fight the fascist terror threat?? )
I've got to say that makes a lot of sense. I still think you are going to get major grief for the comparison.
_________________________
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606910 - 09/05/06 02:17 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
When will the right apologize FOR GWB and Rove???
If you catch them after a few drinks, they get all weepy, and mumble, "Awwww man, we had no effing idea it would turn out like that...."
I'm sure in the 1920's, a lot of people thought electing Hitler was a good idea too...
Wow. In my opinion, you're insane.
Psst, Mark, don't get in the way. It will be sickly fascinating to see how far the two of them can take this.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606911 - 09/05/06 02:53 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Gold Star
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 382
|
Quote:
"Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?"
NO.
I'm not sure why "the left" would have anything to apologize for. The CIA was the one that requested an investigation into whether there was a crime committed by outing one of their operatives, and the CIA certainly isn't "the left".
The special prosecutor was then appointed by the Attorney General's office in the Bush Administration, and that office is not part of "the left".
Rove admits he confirmed the information provided by Armitage and neither of them are a part of "the left".
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606912 - 09/05/06 03:15 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
100 Club
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 158
Planet Earth
|
Quote:
It wasn't a direct comparison of GWB to Hitler as individuals. However each was originally elected by the people, each turned out to be horribly different than what the electorate envisioned, and each had a hold over people such that they kept him in office against their own best interests. Each one "stayed the course" even when it became clear the course was disasterous. Each was hard-headed and did not take advice well.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Hitler was ever elected to an office. If I'm not mistaken, he was appointed vice-chancellor by Hindenburg, who he then forced to step down.
That said, what good liberal doesn't enjoy painting W out as another Hitler? (Just kidding neo-cons, calm down)
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606913 - 09/05/06 03:22 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Power Poster
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,994
|
Quote:
Quote:
It wasn't a direct comparison of GWB to Hitler as individuals. However each was originally elected by the people, each turned out to be horribly different than what the electorate envisioned, and each had a hold over people such that they kept him in office against their own best interests. Each one "stayed the course" even when it became clear the course was disasterous. Each was hard-headed and did not take advice well.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Hitler was ever elected to an office. If I'm not mistaken, he was appointed vice-chancellor by Hindenburg, who he then forced to step down.
That said, what good liberal doesn't enjoy painting W out as another Hitler? (Just kidding neo-cons, calm down)
I think it's funny that neo-cons get all worked up with comparisons to Nazis, but they freely call anyone to the left of Rush Limbaugh a communist. 
_________________________
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606914 - 09/05/06 03:59 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
|
Quote:
Psst, Mark, don't get in the way. It will be sickly fascinating to see how far the two of them can take this.
Oops - correction. The three of them.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606915 - 09/05/06 04:02 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
|
Quote:
I'm not sure why "the left" would have anything to apologize for. The CIA was the one that requested an investigation into whether there was a crime committed by outing one of their operatives, and the CIA certainly isn't "the left".
The special prosecutor was then appointed by the Attorney General's office in the Bush Administration, and that office is not part of "the left".
Rove admits he confirmed the information provided by Armitage and neither of them are a part of "the left".
The left - including those in the government - created this hill of beans. An example of those who need to apologize are: The NYT, Chris Matthews, truthout.org, and Howard Dean. I'm not holding my breath.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606916 - 09/05/06 04:39 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Gold Star
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 382
|
Quote:
Quote:
I'm not sure why "the left" would have anything to apologize for. The CIA was the one that requested an investigation into whether there was a crime committed by outing one of their operatives, and the CIA certainly isn't "the left".
The special prosecutor was then appointed by the Attorney General's office in the Bush Administration, and that office is not part of "the left".
Rove admits he confirmed the information provided by Armitage and neither of them are a part of "the left".
The left - including those in the government - created this hill of beans. An example of those who need to apologize are: The NYT, Chris Matthews, truthout.org, and Howard Dean. I'm not holding my breath.
You SAY the left "created" this, but you seem to want us to take your word for that without anything to support it.
The CIA requested the probe, do you deny that?
The Bush AG's office appointed the special prosecutor, do you deny that?
Armitage gave out the information and Rove confirmed it, do you deny that?
Do you consider any of those to be part of "the left"? These are the "creators" of the probe, right?
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606917 - 09/05/06 06:49 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
|
I KNOW that the entire issue was non-existent until the flames of "scandal" were flamed by David Corn, editor of the leftist rag The Nation - and, not coincidentally, author of the book making a splash debunking the Rovian plot theory. Novak's article never said Plame was covert, and no one had any reason to think her employment was classified until Corn started trumpeting that "fact", at the urging of her husband, the editorialist/liar.
Non Ron, you can keep trying to pretend this was really a scandal, and that the White House is to blame for it. Nobody buys it anymore, not even the liberal mainstream media that was so instrumental in this molehill's construction.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606918 - 09/05/06 07:14 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Diamond Poster
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,407
Midwest
|
Quote:
Quote:
It wasn't a direct comparison of GWB to Hitler as individuals. However each was originally elected by the people, each turned out to be horribly different than what the electorate envisioned, and each had a hold over people such that they kept him in office against their own best interests. Each one "stayed the course" even when it became clear the course was disasterous. Each was hard-headed and did not take advice well.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Hitler was ever elected to an office. If I'm not mistaken, he was appointed vice-chancellor by Hindenburg, who he then forced to step down.
<snip>
Well, not precisely. Yes, President Hindenburg (reluctantly... oh so reluctantly!) appointed Hitler Chancellor (not Vice Chancellor) in 1933. However, Hitler never forced Hindenburg to step down. The Grim Reaper is the only one who forced Hindenburg down... he died in August of 1934. After his death, Hitler's cabinet, for various and some obvious reasons (they didn't want to lose power!) didn't want to hold another presidential election. Instead, they simply forced through a law that caused the presidency to be declared "dormant". Hitler was then proclaimed Fuhrer (leader) as well as Reichskanzler (chancellor) and there was no "president". This also caused Hitler to become supreme commander of the military by default.
Yes, I'll agree that up until this point, Hitler was not "elected" or explicitly approved/chosen by the people.
However...
(I'm quoting from wikipedia here because I liked their wording and I wanted to get this exactly straight for the facts... the portion in square brackets is mine for clarity):
"In a mid-August plebiscite these acts [declaring the presidency dormant and appointing Hitler as Fuhrer AND Chancellor] found the approval of 90% of the electorate. Combining the highest offices in state, military and party in his hand, Hitler had attained supreme rule that could no longer be legally challenged."
Here's a definition of plebiscite from dictionary.com. Basically, it's an election, and Hitler got 90% of the vote.
–noun 1. a direct vote of the qualified voters of a state in regard to some important public question.
2. the vote by which the people of a political unit determine autonomy or affiliation with another country.
----------------------------------------------------
[Origin: 1525–35; < F < L plēbīscītum decree of the plebs, equiv. to plēbī (for plēbis, plēbēī gen. sing. of plēbs, plēbēs plebs) + scītum resolution, decree, n. use of neut. of scītus, ptp. of scīscere to enact, decree, orig., to seek to know, learn, inchoative of scīre to know]
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.0.1)
Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006
_________________________
"Gratitude makes sense of our past, brings peace for today, and creates a vision for tomorrow." - Melody Beattie
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606919 - 09/05/06 07:18 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Power Poster
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,349
|
Keep in mind anyone can get their message posted on Wilkapedia. I would not use it as source for any stretch of the imagination.
_________________________
If your tagline references disclaimers regarding the nature of political posts, then you should just hit notify.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606920 - 09/05/06 07:21 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Diamond Poster
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,407
Midwest
|
I quoted wikipedia because I liked their wording OF THE FACTS, which I already knew from my education and past reading. Check out any history book if you don't believe a plebiscite occurred after Hitler was made Fuhrer. lol
_________________________
"Gratitude makes sense of our past, brings peace for today, and creates a vision for tomorrow." - Melody Beattie
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606921 - 09/05/06 07:23 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Power Poster
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,349
|
I am not debating the facts, I am debating the use of Wilkapedia as a "source". I believe you, and admit I do not know my German history like you seem to.
_________________________
If your tagline references disclaimers regarding the nature of political posts, then you should just hit notify.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606922 - 09/05/06 07:22 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Platinum Poster
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 555
Texas
|
Quote:
plebiscite
Does wikipedia recommend a cure?
_________________________
What is man, that thou art mindful of him?
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606923 - 09/05/06 07:23 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 10,395
Jersey Shore
|
Quote:
I am not debating the facts, I am debating the use of Wilkapedia as a "source"...
And yet you managed to do it in such a way as to dismiss AnnMarie's entire post. Such economy of style is admirable.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606924 - 09/05/06 07:30 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
Gold Star
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 382
|
Quote:
Non Ron, you can keep trying to pretend this was really a scandal, and that the White House is to blame for it.
Actually, anyone can look back at the posts and see what I actualy said - that it was the CIA that requested the investigation and the AG's office that appointed the special prosecutor. Neither of these are "the left" which you said started the probe. You continue to avoid commenting on their role, not surprising, since doing that would destroy your argument.
Quote:
no one had any reason to think her employment was classified until Corn started trumpeting that "fact"
Well, yes, the CIA had reason to think that and that why they asked for the investigation. Do you really think that the CIA didn't know what the status of their own employee was when they asked for the probe?
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
#606926 - 09/05/06 09:31 PM
Re: Will the Left apologize to GWB and Rove now?
|
10K Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 12,846
|
Quote:
Actually, anyone can look back at the posts and see what I actualy said - that it was the CIA that requested the investigation and the AG's office that appointed the special prosecutor. Neither of these are "the left" which you said started the probe.
Actually, anyone can look back at my posts and see that I never said the left initiated the probe. The left created the kerfluffle which led to the probe. Deny it if you like; nobody else is buying it.
Quote:
Well, yes, the CIA had reason to think that and that why they asked for the investigation. Do you really think that the CIA didn't know what the status of their own employee was when they asked for the probe?
And, obviously, the CIA is not a political animal, and is never influenced by political motives. Case closed, I guess.
|
|
Return to Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
Previous Thread
Index