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#67417 - 03/13/03 08:42 PM
Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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At our OFAC/BSA training today an employee told me she thought she should file a SAR on a customer. The customer comes in with a briefcase handcuffed to his hand and asked to go in his Safe Deposit Box. The employee said she has seen him very carefully lift the corner of the box and it appeared to her to have wires in the box. She is afraid it might be some kind of explosive . I told her to file a SAR immediately. However, I am not familiar with the Safe Deposit Box laws. Employees are not supposed to know what is the customers box. Should we contact law enforcement? Any advice would be appreciated.
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#67419 - 03/13/03 08:52 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Platinum Poster
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 921
Down South, USA
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What I am about to suggest may not give you any conclusive answers, but the first thing I would do is to check what else you know about the customer. .... How long has he banked with you? Is he local, or has he moved to your city/ state/ the US recently? Is his account activity consistent with his known occupation? Does he have a credit/ATM card that has been used outside the US? Does he make or receive transfers of funds regularly? Does he do much cash business? Does he have family with accounts at your bank?
Basically build yourself as complete a picture as you can before you consider what to do next. If, and others here no doubt know much more than I on this, there is a mechansism to report your concerns, then you'll be asked (subject to whatever orders/ subpoenas are appropriate) for all this information anyway by whatever law enforcement agency investigates the matter.
_________________________
This is my opinion; it is not legal advice, nor the view of my employer, and it may change tomorrow.
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#67429 - 03/17/03 09:15 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Power Poster
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,608
Near the Land of Enchantment
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What would be the next step, if explosives are detected? Is that cause to drill the box? Would the bomb squad cordon off your vault and take over?
_________________________
Opinions my own.
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#67431 - 03/17/03 10:02 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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HOLD THAT SAR REPORT!!!..............last time I looked, safe deposit activity was exempted from SAR requirements. You certainly have some issues here, but one of them is not the requirement to file an SAR report.
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#67433 - 03/17/03 10:54 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Gold Star
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 434
New Jersey
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Before you call in the dogs check out this news story: bad dog
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#67434 - 03/17/03 11:25 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Sorry, just got back to my desk after some a notary questions from a personal banker. Take a look at the Federal Register from Monday, February 5,1996 (Vol. 61, No. 24, p 4327). Hopefully you've got it handy. FinCEN discusses why (after it received strong comments) it decided to drop safe deposit activity from the definition of "Transaction". See 31 CFR 103.11 (ii) (b) "Treatment of Safe Deposit Boxes". Commenters logic as to why the opposed the inclusion in the definition of transaction included: long established banking practice where customer's use of safe deposit was a private transaction, not an account, potentially contrary to state law, etc. In explaining why they dropped it, FinCEN makes a reference to what might constitute a VOLUNTARY Safe Deposit SAR and it relates to where a bank has entered a box (search warrant?) and discovers criminally-derived property. But again, the SAR would still only be voluntary. I have never filed an SAR on safe deposit activity regardless of the referrals I have received from staff ("customer eneters the box 4 days out of 5", "he wears a lot of gold", "I think I smell marijuana!"). Since whether or not we ever file an SAR is confidential throughout the organization, there are only a few employees that know if an SAR was actually filed. The referrals continue from safe deposit because staff does not realize they are 99.9% not likely to be filed. During training I don't want to point out the safe deposit activity is not included, because I want them to remain vigilant regardless of what area of the bank they are in. I'm really glad I did not sign-in today and that I am posting anon. now that I read this post! But, I continue to see safe deposit/SAR filing issues on BOL and I think we need to clrify IT IS NOT REQUIRED (but a bank certainly could voluntarily file if they enjoy paperwork).
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#67437 - 03/18/03 02:10 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
.... If a customer is storing bomb-making materials in a safe deposit box, it probably isn't set to go off.
I'm glad that you're so confident in the quality control procedures of amateur bombmakers.
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#67439 - 03/18/03 07:52 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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10K Club
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 83,219
Galveston, TX
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What I can't believe is that you have the potential for a bomb in your vault and the debate is whether or not to file a SAR??? How about the next time he shows up you call the police and tell him to remove all contents of the box, tell him you no longer want to do business with him, and have him escorted from the building. Why are you messing around with this? There is no law that says you have to do business or rent a box or keep renting a box to anyone. It is not their god given right to have a box at your bank - pull the plug before somebody gets hurt!
_________________________
The opinions expressed here should not be construed to be those of my employer: PPDocs.com
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#67440 - 03/18/03 08:01 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Arthur,
Thank you for the link to the article by David P. McGuinn "Safe Deposit Box Bulging With Cash". The article is well written, but I believe the author has provided some inaccurate guidance (specifically #3 in the section entitled "It Is Still A Gray Area"). I'm fairly certain the only time FinCEN has dealt with the safe deposit issue is in my post above (see Fed. Register from feb. 5, 1996). Therefore, I would ask the author his cite for point #3 in his article.
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#67441 - 03/18/03 08:09 PM
Re: Safe Deposit May Have Explosives
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Power Poster
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,608
Near the Land of Enchantment
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Not to speak for Mr. McGuinn, but I think he just restated the same point you made in your earlier post - the SAR is voluntary - at the discretion of the bank. Quote:
...FinCEN makes a reference to what might constitute a VOLUNTARY Safe Deposit SAR and it relates to where a bank has entered a box (search warrant?) and discovers criminally-derived property. But again, the SAR would still only be voluntary... ...and I think we need to clrify IT IS NOT REQUIRED (but a bank certainly could voluntarily file if they enjoy paperwork).
Mr. McGuinn's point:
"If a consumer is observed using his safe deposit box in ways that are considered suspicious, the financial institution might voluntarily submit a report. This exclusion could be construed as a subtle attempt to place accountability back in the lap of the financial institution."
I think you're making the same point. Both of you drew conclusions based on what FinCEN stated.
_________________________
Opinions my own.
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