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#850760 - 11/07/07 06:37 PM Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters
CalifDreamin Offline
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From today's TBA Weekly:

Quote:
Home equity amendment passes
Last night, Texas voters overwhelmingly approved Proposition 8, the constitutional amendment designed to clarify certain provisions relating to the making of home equity loans and lines of credit. The clarifying provisions include providing:

--That the lender must only provide the borrower with copies of the documents signed at time of the closing of the home equity loan;
--That the prohibition of a borrower signing an instrument with blanks that are left to be filled in would only relate to blanks "relating to substantive terms of agreement";
--That a home equity loan cannot be secured by homestead property that on the date of closing is designated for agricultural use (other than dairy production); and
--That the 12-day cooling off period before a loan closing begins to run when a borrower submits an application.


Proposition 8 also provided for an exception to the prohibition that a new home equity loan cannot be made within one year of a previous home equity loan. In the case of a declared state of emergency (i.e., Hurricanes Katrina or Rita), a new home equity loan can be made before the one year anniversary of the original home equity loan.

Under the Constitution, an amendment approved by voters is effective on the date of the official canvass of returns showing adoption. The date of canvass, by law, is not earlier than the 15th or later than the 30th day after election day. Thus, Proposition 8 will take effect on the date of the official canvass.



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#851301 - 11/08/07 03:11 PM Re: Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters CalifDreamin
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thanks Flamingo for the info, these loans are still way too complicated though aren't they?

I have a personal anectodal story, really a nightmare - my bank has messed me up to the point where I now have two home equity loans, the combination of which may exceed 80% loan to value when added to my first lien. All I wanted to do was increase the amount of the line, but the out of state folks had a better idea
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#851308 - 11/08/07 03:16 PM Re: Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters Pale Rider
swiggles Offline
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Since you can only have one home equity loan at a time, I think that the lien on the second loan is invalid.
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#851326 - 11/08/07 03:31 PM Re: Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters swiggles
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Originally Posted By: swiggles
Since you can only have one home equity loan at a time, I think that the lien on the second loan is invalid.


oh indeed it is swiggles, but this is my employer I am dealing with so we are gonna fix it without too much hassle by replacing one of the HELOCs with a personal loan
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#851330 - 11/08/07 03:33 PM Re: Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters Pale Rider
swiggles Offline
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Hey.....that's good for you. You get to have your cake and eat it too!!!
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#857042 - 11/19/07 04:24 PM Re: Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters swiggles
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Can anyone tell me when these changes take effect and where can I find the changes?

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#857403 - 11/19/07 09:26 PM Re: Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters Comply101
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#858613 - 11/20/07 10:48 PM Re: Home Equity Prop 8 Passed By Voters Comply101
CalifDreamin Offline
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ToTo's link will give you the detailed analysis as well as the new wording for the disclosure. As mentioned above, the effective date is the date of the official canvass of returns showing adoption. The date of canvass, by law, is not earlier than the 15th or later than the 30th day after election day. Thus, Proposition 8 will take effect on the date of the official canvass - December 6th at the latest as I understand it.
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#858764 - 11/21/07 02:10 PM Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 CalifDreamin
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Just received notice from IBAT that the Home Equity changes will be effective December 4th. Here's the link to the announcement by the Secretary of State regarding the canvassing Canvass December 4 .

According to IBAT, this means that you will need to start using the new home equity notice on Friday, November 23rd in order to be compliance for closings on or after December 5th. Are your vendors ready? Probably not.
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#858814 - 11/21/07 02:50 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 CalifDreamin
M Cockrell Offline
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How can you begin to use a form that doesn't officially go into effect until the canvassing date???
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#858847 - 11/21/07 03:10 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 M Cockrell
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I agree with MC. We can't give the new notice until the effective date. Unless you can close the loan under the old rules prior to the effective date, then I think you have to start the 12 days from scratch on the effective date. Also don't forget the other change that you have to give a copy of the application with the disclosure that you give the day before the closing, and you have to give a copy of the final application at the closing.

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#858874 - 11/21/07 03:30 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 ToTo
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I haven't read the full details of these changes-can someone give me the cliff notes version for the average Joe Customer and how it really effects them??? Just from what I read it doesn't seem to have really changed anything.
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#858901 - 11/21/07 03:48 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 mck401
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As stated above in the email I got from IBAT as well as numerous meetings I've attending that have touched on this - really nothing changed - it just clarified things, but the wording of the notice has changed. As stated above, the following clarifications were made:

--That the lender must only provide the borrower with copies of the documents signed at time of the closing of the home equity loan;
--That the prohibition of a borrower signing an instrument with blanks that are left to be filled in would only relate to blanks "relating to substantive terms of agreement";
--That a home equity loan cannot be secured by homestead property that on the date of closing is designated for agricultural use (other than dairy production); and
--That the 12-day cooling off period before a loan closing begins to run when a borrower submits an application.

Update on the effective date - what I stated earlier about when to give the notice may not be entirely correct.

The e-mail this morning from IBAT stated:
Quote:
You may send out the revised notice 12 days before the effective date in order to be able to close on the revised forms. This gets a bit convoluted, but here is our quick assessment . . . as 12 days prior to December 4 is Thanksgiving Day, we are recommending that the new regime be followed starting on November 23, for closing on or after December 5.
For closings scheduled prior to December 4, we recommend that you follow the present procedures.


However, it was told to me that Attorney General Opinion DM-452 says something differently - essentially that the new notice cannot be used until the effective date, I guess. Here's the link: AG Opinion DM-452

All I can say is that I really don't like home equity in Texas. It makes me dizzy.
Last edited by FlamingoGal; 11/21/07 04:01 PM.
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#858940 - 11/21/07 04:10 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 CalifDreamin
M Cockrell Offline
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Pursuant to various conversations I've had, the advice has been to offer both versions of the notice until the canvas date. Then, begin using the new NCEC only after that date.
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#859175 - 11/21/07 06:45 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 M Cockrell
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Here is the latest released from IBAT of a summary of changes, including the notice.
http://www.ibat.org/ch_cb_2007_home_equity.asp

Below is a direct quote from this concerning the notice

Notice. The changes to the substance of the home equity loan provisions are also reflected in changes to the notice that must be given to the borrower. Do not use the revised notice until December 4, 2007. For loans in the pipeline that would close after December 4, give the new notice after December 4 and re-start the 12-day cooling off period
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#859346 - 11/21/07 08:43 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 ktac MITCH
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Originally Posted By: PUNKIN
Do not use the revised notice until December 4, 2007. For loans in the pipeline that would close after December 4, give the new notice after December 4 and re-start the 12-day cooling off period


You've got to be joking! Gee....that will go over like a lead balloon. If I understand the above correctly, if a customer submits an application this Friday, that person will experience a 23 day waiting period????????
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#859356 - 11/21/07 08:50 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 swiggles
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Yes Swiggles,
That is the way I understand it -- from IBAT.

There was an IBAT email yesterday 11-20, from an EVP that said start giving the new disclosure on 11-23 (12 days before the effective date).
I am guessing he got overruled by the IBAT general counsel, (who put out the report I linked to above 11-21) and now their recommendation is to wait until the effective date - Dec 6 - & then give new disclosure & wait 12 days from then .
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#859386 - 11/21/07 09:06 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 ktac MITCH
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Where can I obtain a "clean" copy of the revised NCEC?
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#859496 - 11/21/07 09:45 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 ktac MITCH
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[quote=PUNKIN]Here is the latest released from IBAT of a summary of changes, including the notice.
http://www.ibat.org/ch_cb_2007_home_equity.asp

From my post above, you can copy and paste the language for the notice from this website.
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#860367 - 11/26/07 05:13 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 swiggles
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Originally Posted By: swiggles
Originally Posted By: PUNKIN
Do not use the revised notice until December 4, 2007. For loans in the pipeline that would close after December 4, give the new notice after December 4 and re-start the 12-day cooling off period


You've got to be joking! Gee....that will go over like a lead balloon. If I understand the above correctly, if a customer submits an application this Friday, that person will experience a 23 day waiting period????????


Just as a "double verification". We received info from the law firm that provides our HE docs - Pierson & Patterson - and they said the same thing as IBAT.
DO NOT give the new notice before Dec 4 & then start the 12 day period then. For loans in the pipeline they must close before Dec 4 with the old notice.
SO - some apps. will have an extended time waiting for the effective date to come & the 12 days to start.
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#860407 - 11/26/07 05:55 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 ktac MITCH
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Originally Posted By: ktac MITCH
[SO - some apps. will have an extended time waiting for the effective date to come & the 12 days to start.


Yup......right here during the holidays when people are wanting money in a hurry. 'Course, a person should NOT pledge his or her homestead property to buy Christmas gifts!! That would NOT be considered a "worthwhile purpose!"
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#860411 - 11/26/07 06:00 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 swiggles
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but wouldn't that be considered a bona fide emergency???


JUST KIDDING!
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#860433 - 11/26/07 06:25 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 M Cockrell
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Originally Posted By: M Cockrell
but wouldn't that be considered a bona fide emergency???


Why, YES!! Yes it would!!!
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#860557 - 11/26/07 08:09 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 swiggles
Tom at HOME Offline
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We spend money we don't have,
To purchase things we don't need,
To impress people we don't like.

Merry Christmas

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#860583 - 11/26/07 08:37 PM Re: Home Eq. Changes Effective December 4 Tom at HOME
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Ha Ha....very good Tom.

Fortunately, I give people things because I just simply like to. I love giving.....

Receiving?....well that's nice too, but not important to me.

If you want a thought-provoking statement...here's one.

Most people spend the winter trying to make their houses as warm as they were trying to keep their house from being in the summer.

Go figure.
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