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#964763 - 05/23/08 06:46 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA straw
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Originally Posted By: straw
You switch meds or something?


No, I'm just growing.

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#964785 - 05/23/08 07:07 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA B_F
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Originally Posted By: Bengalsfan
However, there is a link between the Judeo-Christian-Islamic traditions. It's just a question of when the messiah/prophet came/will come.

I'm in line with many who are now trying to accentuate the commonalities of three related religions and try to bring them together rather than separate them.


You--or they--have your work cut out for you. How would you resolve the following mutually exclusive claims:

"Verily I am Allah: there is no god but I:
so serve thou me (only) and establish regular
prayer for celebrating My praise."

Sûrah Tâ Hâ (20:14)

And God spoke all these words:
"I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
"You shall have no other gods before me."
Exodus 20:1-3

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

John 14:6
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#964791 - 05/23/08 07:13 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Sinatra Fan
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It's not mutually exclusive. One God, multiple names. Yahweh, Jehovah, Allah.

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#964800 - 05/23/08 07:19 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA B_F
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Originally Posted By: Bengalsfan
It's not mutually exclusive. One God, multiple names. Yahweh, Jehovah, Allah.


Sorry, negative on that one.
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#964801 - 05/23/08 07:22 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
Originally Posted By: Bengalsfan
It's not mutually exclusive. One God, multiple names. Yahweh, Jehovah, Allah.


Sorry, negative on that one.


Perhaps you should do more historical research. Are you aware that Islam accepts both Moses and Jesus as important prophets of equal value to Muhammed?

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#964805 - 05/23/08 07:26 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA B_F
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tis true.

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#964807 - 05/23/08 07:29 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA straw
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BF is square on the money.
We of the Christian, Jewish, and Islamic faiths all worship the same God.

It is through the Prophets and the divinity of Christ where the differences are clearer.

But we (Christian - Judaism - Islam) are all Abrahamic religions.

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#964810 - 05/23/08 07:31 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Imagine
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BF, Christians believe Jesus is God incarnate, not a "Prophet."
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#964811 - 05/23/08 07:32 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
BF, Christians believe Jesus is God incarnate, not a "Prophet."


This is true.
Yet, there is also a SUPREME God who is the same SUPREME God that is spoken of in Islam and Judaism.

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#964815 - 05/23/08 07:34 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Imagine
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So, Christ is God, just not the Supreme God?
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#964817 - 05/23/08 07:36 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
So, Christ is God, just not the Supreme God?


The Holy Trinity is unique to Christianity.
God, The Father.
Jesus Christ, Son of God and yet God himself.
and the Holy Spirit.

They are 3 seperate things, and yet all the same being.

That same SUPREME being is the SAME God as Islam and Judaism.

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#964821 - 05/23/08 07:39 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Imagine
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So, Christ was lying?

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

John 14:6
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#964822 - 05/23/08 07:40 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
So, Christ was lying?

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

John 14:6


No. Christ was not lying. As a Christian, you and I believe in the divinity of Christ.

However, the concept of The Father is a Supreme Being. The SAME Supreme Being that ALL of the Abrahamic Religions share.

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#964824 - 05/23/08 07:41 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
So, Christ was lying?

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

John 14:6


Tell me, how do you reconcile the OT stating Thou Shalt Have No Other God Before Me (Yahweh) with Christ is God?

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#964825 - 05/23/08 07:41 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
BF, Christians believe Jesus is God incarnate, not a "Prophet."


So are you saying then that Christians and Jews don't share the same One God because the Jews don't believe Christ was the Messiah or God?

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#964826 - 05/23/08 07:42 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Imagine
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Assuming Christ is the son of God (being Jewish I can't really state that he is), Christ would be the son of the same God Jews pray too.

Muslims believe that Jews followed Issac, the son of Abraham, while Ismael, the other son of Abraham through a handmaiden Hagar, gave rise ultimately to Mohammed and Islam.

This is why for centuries Jews and Muslims (mainly Arab Muslims) were actually very close, believing themselves to be cousins.

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#964827 - 05/23/08 07:42 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA B_F
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I believe, if you read the OT closely, it foreshadows the coming of Christ as the Redeemer.

And Christ IS God.

God gave us himself in man-form to save us.
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#964829 - 05/23/08 07:43 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA straw
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I'm going to jinx it, I know I am...but are we all actually having a civilized academic conversation on religion?


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#964832 - 05/23/08 07:45 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
I believe, if you read the OT closely, it foreshadows the coming of Christ as the Redeemer.

And Christ IS God.

God gave us himself in man-form to save us.


And you're entitled to that belief, as a Christian.
Just as Straw is entitled to his beliefs as a member of the Jewish faith.

The question is, do you believe that the Hebrew God is the same God in Christianity. Keep in mind the OT when answering.

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#964835 - 05/23/08 07:46 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Imagine
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Originally Posted By: Imagine
We of the Christian, Jewish, and Islamic faiths all worship the same God.

It is through the Prophets and the divinity of Christ where the differences are clearer.

But we (Christian - Judaism - Islam) are all Abrahamic religions.


First, are they the same or are they different?

Second, Christianity goes back before the time of Abraham. It is not an "Abrahamic" religion.

Third, even if Judaism--through Isaac--and Islam--through Ishmael--share a common ancestor, that does not make them the same. My siblings and I have the same mother and father, but that does not make us the same; similar, yes, but not identical or interchangeable.
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#964836 - 05/23/08 07:47 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
I believe, if you read the OT closely, it foreshadows the coming of Christ as the Redeemer.

And Christ IS God.

God gave us himself in man-form to save us.


Yes, we know you believe that, but every religion believes it is the right one and the only way to divinity.

Accepting other religions does not mean you have to disavow your own.

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#964839 - 05/23/08 07:47 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA MB Guy
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Originally Posted By: MB Guy
I believe, if you read the OT closely, it foreshadows the coming of Christ as the Redeemer.

And Christ IS God.

God gave us himself in man-form to save us.


So if Christ IS God, from the old testament, how is he not the same God worshiped by Jews and Muslims? It all goes back to the same one God, the God of Abraham.

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#964841 - 05/23/08 07:48 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Sinatra Fan
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Originally Posted By: Sinatra Fan
Originally Posted By: Imagine
We of the Christian, Jewish, and Islamic faiths all worship the same God.

It is through the Prophets and the divinity of Christ where the differences are clearer.

But we (Christian - Judaism - Islam) are all Abrahamic religions.


First, are they the same or are they different?

Second, Christianity goes back before the time of Abraham. It is not an "Abrahamic" religion.

Third, even if Judaism--through Isaac--and Islam--through Ishmael--share a common ancestor, that does not make them the same. My siblings and I have the same mother and father, but that does not make us the same; similar, yes, but not identical or interchangeable.


But you honor the SAME mother and father, right? Noone is saying that Judaism, Islam, and Christianity are the SAME religion here, just that they share common ancestry and a common bond in the same God.

Just as Catholics, Baptists, etc. all worship the same God. There's a bit more of a divide, when you go further to Judaism and Islam, but it is the same One God.
Last edited by Bengalsfan; 05/23/08 07:49 PM.
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#964843 - 05/23/08 07:50 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Sinatra Fan
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Originally Posted By: Sinatra Fan
Originally Posted By: Imagine
We of the Christian, Jewish, and Islamic faiths all worship the same God.

It is through the Prophets and the divinity of Christ where the differences are clearer.

But we (Christian - Judaism - Islam) are all Abrahamic religions.


First, are they the same or are they different?

Second, Christianity goes back before the time of Abraham. It is not an "Abrahamic" religion.

Third, even if Judaism--through Isaac--and Islam--through Ishmael--share a common ancestor, that does not make them the same. My siblings and I have the same mother and father, but that does not make us the same; similar, yes, but not identical or interchangeable.


First, the original God is the same God for all three religions. Path to God is radically different for all three religions.

Second, sorry but you are wrong regarding Christianity pre-dating Abraham. Abraham is considered the father of Monotheism and since Judaism is definitely older than Christianity, BF is correct. All three Monotheistic religions started from the same root.

Third, BF is not saying the three religions are the same. They just share the same roots, with vastly different approaches brnaching off those same roots.

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#964844 - 05/23/08 07:50 PM Re: Dem Senators Split on Obama Call to Repeal DOMA Sinatra Fan
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Originally Posted By: Sinatra Fan
Second, Christianity goes back before the time of Abraham. It is not an "Abrahamic" religion.


Mind showing any proof whatsoever of that? I think you're way off base here.

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