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#93919 - 07/03/03 12:44 AM
Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Anonymous
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hello everyone!! I just started working for a bank, and I found out that a lot of promotions within my bank are done based on how much/long you worked for the bank. In another words, university degrees such as BA, BS does not really help to give you more qualifications than another co-worker who just has High School disploma but has worked at the bank more than you.  Is your bank like this, too? Do you know any particular position within a BANK that assigns weight on your degree (or other academic accomplishments/knowledges)?? Thanks for your inputs !! 
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#93920 - 07/03/03 12:59 AM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Power Poster
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 7,353
Anchorage Alaska
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While a degree is always nice, and some weight is warranted the commitment it takes to earn one, I haven't worked at many banks that promote based on degrees. Sometimes I've seen that a person without a degree has to work a few more years to establish their merit to a firm, promotions are typically given due to the work preformed on the job, not beforehand. I've worked in some of the largest banks in the nation, and a smaller state wide firm. In all areas, my skills were the benefit that earned me the promotions I've received. Education levels were not an issue. Work hard, prove you're worthy of the promotions, and they'll come. Don't hang your hat on the diploma 
_________________________
Dawn Coursey VP/CRA Queen
CRA Rating is in...Oh who cares...I'm home with the baby.
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#93921 - 07/03/03 01:26 AM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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When I entered into banking I was in the process of obtaining my bachelors degree and once I finally got it I had been in banking for about 3 years. The promotions that I got along the way were 1)based on luck (someone had to leave for me to get it!), 2)my work ethic, 3)my ability to manage and work with all folk, 4)my knowledge of banking, and last but not least 5)my degree! Shocker, I know. That is the problem, especially your last year in college, is sometimes they don't quite prepare us for what our expectations should be when you actually go out to get these great jobs. We expect to immediately become a Sr. VP overnite and in reality it doesn't often work that way. Your degree should show those in management your willingness to learn and stick with a job. Take the opportunity to learn as much as you can. I personally wouldn't want someone who has never been in banking to suddenly come in and be my boss. Not just because they recently earned a degree, but simply because they can't contribute to answering and assisting in day to day problem solving that is required in banking. Bide your time and learn all you can. Banking is a great place to have a career. Good luck. ____________________________ I'm at home, so therefore not logged in properly. Mackenzie 
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#93922 - 07/03/03 02:43 AM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Spend your time learning the business instead of worrying why your new degree hasn't propelled you to the executive suite. You should also work on your grammar and communications skills.
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#93923 - 07/03/03 01:01 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Power Poster
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,568
New Jersey
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A degree may help you get an interview faster, or get in the door easier, but once you're in a bank--or any other business--the determiner should be "what do you contribute to the success of this organization?" I entered banking at the ground level with a degree in English and one year of graduate school. Did that directly contribute to my rising through the ranks to EVP? No, not at all. Did the knowledge, skills, and reasoning ability that I acquired and honed in my academic pursuits contribute to my career? Absolutely. One of my favorite aphorisms is "Don't confuse schooling with education." I'll bet that you learn a lot more on the job than you did in college. Enjoy it! 
_________________________
Management is doing things right; leadership is doing the right things. Peter Drucker
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#93924 - 07/03/03 01:16 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Diamond Poster
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,678
United States
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I agree wholeheartedly with the above posters. The dirty little secret that colleges don't let students in on is that a degree guarantees you nothing except graduation and a hefty student loan bill. No business that wants to succeed will put an enormous amount of trust in someone fresh out of college, nor should they. You still have to prove yourself. A degree gives the people who chose to hire you the idea that you are a person who has commitment to a goal, and can work towards achieving it. It's your job now to prove them right, and I am sure that you will. Good luck!
_________________________
Opinions expressed are solely my own.
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#93925 - 07/03/03 01:28 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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100 Club
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 199
South of Boston
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Quote:
Do you know any particular position within a BANK that assigns weight on your degree.
I have worked for both small community banks and large regional banks for over 40 years. I have hired a good number of branch managers during my career. My obsevation is that years ago in the smaller banks a degree was much more important than it is today. Back then a degree was required for candidates looking to become a branch manager. Today, I am more interested in candidates with sales experience and good people skills. Degrees still carry some weight in larger banks where there is more competition for higher level management positions. Experience has taught me that just because someone has a degree from a b-school some where does not necessarily insure that person will be a good banker. Actually some of my most successful managers have come from education backgrounds. They usually have great organizational skills, are used to planning, can speak in front of groups, are open to learning new things and are typically more creative. I can train someone with potential, all the banking skills they need. There are tons of banking courses out there that most banks will gladly pay for. But, personality, good people skills, sound common sense and a desire to succeed, can't be taught and do not necessarily come with a degree. Good luck in adjusting to the real world of banking!
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#93926 - 07/03/03 03:45 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Gold Star
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 455
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In my experience, degrees and certifications are useful for getting technical knowledge and for getting in the door. Once you're in the door, it's all about figuring out that company and showing what you bring to the table. Performance dictates the direction and speed of moving up or down. It is very difficult to be in a company, obtain a degree, and have the degree the primary factor for a promotion unless it was agreed before that this would happen. ("You have done well, and if you finish this degree you will be promoted to X position.") I was in a position at another company when I received my undergraduate degree. When I approached my manager at the end of the program (a mistake to wait that long) to ask about career options at the company since I was about to get my degree, he responded that degrees meant very little. He said he had a degree in one field and worked in another, so why should my degree make a difference. I gave my notice shortly thereafter thinking it was unfair to be treated that way. Was the best decision I made, but for the wrong reason. The lateral move put me in a new position with a higher salary. Move again after a graduate degree and certification - another significant salary increase and a great position. By this time I had several years of experience under my belt, which helped considerably, but the degrees and certification helped put me over the top. Just my two bits.
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#93927 - 07/03/03 04:42 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Power Poster
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 5,564
Clintonville, WI, USA
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Our bank is currently having a morale problem with regard to this type of thing. The old management always gave promotions based on time served. Not necessarily ability. Now that the new management is looking at ability and productivity, several old timers got passed over for promotions in favor of hiring outside the bank. And they are p***ed! I agree with management in this regard; the people that have been hired from outside the bank are eager to prove themselves and do a good job. The old timers have gotten complacent.
That's not to say that the old timers aren't valuable assets to the bank. If they weren't, this new management would be looking for replacements.
It just goes to show, you can't rest on your laurels.
_________________________
Member of the National Sarcasm Society - like we need your support!
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#93928 - 07/03/03 05:04 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I have been in banking just short of 20 yrs. I have many hours of college education, but no degree. Most of the courses that I have taken were through an organization called AIB (American Institute of Banking), on the college campus but taught by bankers. The benefit I found in taking these courses was recognizing the greek when it was spoken in the banking industry and it provided a good foundation for growth. It did not teach me how to apply what was taught to everday situations, or how to be a good employee or banker.
My reasons for not obtaining a degree had nothing to do with whether I am committed, willing to learn, or otherwise, but were valid reasons. Some are fortunate to have the opportunity, some are not. In a lot of professions, and specifically banking, those who were not as fortunate deserve the opportunity to advance based on the same merits of the college graduate. Commitment, comprehension, knowledge, and leadership cannot be taught in college.
Two positions that I have held were both first held by people with some sort of certification w/o prior bank experience, both failed. One was a certified network administrator and the other a CPA. Both were initially placed in charge of implementing a new department within their field of expertise, network administration and internal audit. I ended up supervising the CNA and taking the job of the CPA. I do respect those who have achieved such certification or a degree, but I only concern myself with my own future, not theirs. I think it is great if they put it to good use and advance ahead for the right reasons. I have just found that book knowledge is not nearly enough or as advangtageous as "the school of hard knocks"!
Your degree has given you a foundation on which to grow and a couple years jump on someone without one, now you should focus on applying it to the "real world".
Good luck with all your future endeavors, I hope you achieve satisfaction someday!
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#93929 - 07/03/03 05:51 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Diamond Poster
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,685
Indiana
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I agree that a degree may open the door, but it will be performance on the job that would (and should IMO) determine promotions. AIB is great for bank education and it helped me alot to do my job better. I have been an AIB teacher for the past 6 years. My degree is in business education, not banking so AIB gave me the knowledge I needed, but using your knowledge well in your job is what counts and classes and books don't tell you everything that you need to know.
I will give you an example of what I mean in another field---surgery. I have a doctor friend who when he started out after college, med school, resdency, etc., was finally in the operating room when the surgeon handed him the scapel and said to make the incision. Well, he cut, but didn't get too deep, so he cut again and still wasn't through the skin enough and he realized with all his training they had never told him how hard to press down on the scapel when making an incision. Go figure.
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#93930 - 07/03/03 06:11 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Gold Star
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 484
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Quote:
Spend your time learning the business instead of worrying why your new degree hasn't propelled you to the executive suite. You should also work on your grammar and communications skills.
I second that motion. Is this a joke? All posters should give those that are offering "free" input the "courtesy" of a reasonable level of grammar and spelling. I'm far from perfect (but not that far), but I at least try to get it right or at least readable.
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#93931 - 07/03/03 09:41 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Power Poster
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 4,615
SC
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Quote:
I just started working for a bank, and I found out that a lot of promotions within my bank are done based on how much/long you worked for the bank.
Welcome to the great world of banking. Whether you choose to remain in banking or move on, keep in mind that the longer you work somewhere, the more practical experience you'll gain. It's this experience that will help you advance.
Fast forward 10 years. You have your degree, you've worked in the same company/industry, you've earned the next promotion. Along comes a 21 year old new grad that has never worked in your industry and he/she has more education than you - would you be singing the same tune that you are now?
_________________________
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#93932 - 07/04/03 03:36 AM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Quote:
Spend your time learning the business instead of worrying why your new degree hasn't propelled you to the executive suite. You should also work on your grammar and communications skills.
I second that motion. Is this a joke? All posters should give those that are offering "free" input the "courtesy" of a reasonable level of grammar and spelling. I'm far from perfect (but not that far), but I at least try to get it right or at least readable.
Was the 1st post THAT poor in grammar?? It seems okay to me, no?
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#93933 - 07/04/03 04:28 AM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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10K Club
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 47,532
Bloomington, IN
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Quote:
Was the 1st post THAT poor in grammar?? It seems okay to me, no?
Anon, I do not know if you are the original anon or not, but forgive me, as I am not one to analyze another’s spelling or grammar. Lord knows I make enough mistakes of my own.
However, since you asked, go back, read the original post again, and then read the following revision. I will not say the revision is perfect but you will see a difference.
Hello everyone!
I just started working for a bank, and I found out that many promotions within my bank depend on how long you worked for the bank. In other words, university degrees such as BAs or BSs do not really help give you more qualifications than another co-worker who has only a High School diploma but has worked at the bank longer than you have.
Is your bank like this too?
Do you know any particular position within a BANK that assigns weight on your degree (or other academic accomplishments/knowledge)?
Thanks for your inputs!
Again, I did not do this to embarrass or offend anyone.
Yeah, I know, I know -- I'm suppose to be on vacation.  I had to check in one last time before I left for MO in the morning. 
_________________________
The opinions expressed are mine and they are not to be taken as legal advice.
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#93934 - 07/04/03 06:35 AM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Quote:
Was the 1st post THAT poor in grammar?? It seems okay to me, no?
Anon, I do not know if you are the original anon or not, but forgive me, as I am not one to analyze another’s spelling or grammar. Lord knows I make enough mistakes of my own.
However, since you asked, go back, read the original post again, and then read the following revision. I will not say the revision is perfect but you will see a difference.
Hello everyone!
I just started working for a bank, and I found out that many promotions within my bank depend on how long you worked for the bank. In other words, university degrees such as BAs or BSs do not really help give you more qualifications than another co-worker who has only a High School diploma but has worked at the bank longer than you have.
Is your bank like this too?
Do you know any particular position within a BANK that assigns weight on your degree (or other academic accomplishments/knowledge)?
Thanks for your inputs!
Again, I did not do this to embarrass or offend anyone.
Yeah, I know, I know -- I'm suppose to be on vacation. I had to check in one last time before I left for MO in the morning.
Thanks dpersful
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#93935 - 07/06/03 03:06 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Diamond Poster
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,830
District of Columbia
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I started in banking as a teller in 1979, and have worked in various positions ever since. I have been promoted to Bank Officer at other Banks, but just this year received my first promotion to AVP! I went back to school to finish the undergrad degree I began in 1964, and although the knowledge I have gleaned from my legal classes has helped me in my job, I do not believe it is the reason for my success. I firmly believe that is due to the fact that my manger recognizes my abilities and has made sure that my hard work and diligence have been rewarded.
Incidentally, my manager, who is an EVP, has very little formal education outside of high school. However, she is a fantastic manager and a great organizer, and very much open to learning new things. She freely admits to what she does not know, and is smart enough to surround herself with people who excel in areas where she is weak.
I firmly subscribe to the notion that success in banking is not based on where you went to school, or how many degrees you have, but how hard you are willing to work to succeed and how much you care about ensuring the success of your organization.
BC
_________________________
Being kind is more important than being important.
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#93936 - 07/06/03 07:27 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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10K Club
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 27,752
On the Net
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As a manager, who do you want working in the higher positions, someone with a degree, or someone with experience who knows the ins and outs of getting things done?
When the skillset is level and one person has a degree, that may be what tips the scales. But the effectiveness of the employee/officer is what will provide the person upward mobility.
This may be influenced further by communication skills, accounting knowledge, etc. as this also influences the position within the bank, and there are many. Banks need lenders, operations people, IT and HR, etc. A diverse group is needed to run a bank.
I believe the days of hiring in as a teller and working ones way up is gone though, as there are many skilled people looking to move into new banks with new ideas.
_________________________
AndyZ CRCM
My opinions are not necessarily my employers.
R+R-R=R+R
Rules and Regs minus Relationships equals Resentment and Rebellion. John Maxwell
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#93937 - 07/06/03 11:24 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Be happy you have a job Anon. The promotions will come later.
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#93938 - 07/07/03 12:52 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Power Poster
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 5,564
Clintonville, WI, USA
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Amen to that! I have several friends whose children have just received their degrees, and they have told me the job market is fierce!
_________________________
Member of the National Sarcasm Society - like we need your support!
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#93939 - 07/07/03 03:44 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Platinum Poster
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 927
Milwaukee, WI
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I find it sad when someone asks me "So, how did you get that job? Did you go to school for it?" As if I couldn't do it on my own! Also, my boyfriends family friends are a tad hoity toity (if you know what I mea), the first question they always ask is "Where did you go to school?" and if you can't answer it they look at you as if you are white trash. Sad-just sad!
_________________________
My opinions are not to be construed as legal advice.
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#93940 - 07/07/03 05:18 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Gold Star
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 484
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Quote:
I find it sad when someone asks me "So, how did you get that job? Did you go to school for it?" As if I couldn't do it on my own! Also, my boyfriends family friends are a tad hoity toity (if you know what I mea), the first question they always ask is "Where did you go to school?" and if you can't answer it they look at you as if you are white trash. Sad-just sad!
That's a scenario that happens all the time in banking and it's always the people that have the degree that ask the question.
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#93943 - 07/08/03 01:59 PM
Re: Your BANK's system of Meritocracy
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Platinum Poster
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 942
Kentucky
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Unfortunately, I've worked for banks in the past where people would be hired off the street for management positions because they had business degrees. The hard truth was, they couldn't hack it and didn't last long. They had no experience in the departments or areas they were trying to manage and they had not developed any people skills--essential for dealing with customers and employees. I worked in banking while earning my bachelor's, and I can tell you that this is one industry where experience counts more than education. Having said that, I must add a sidenote to say I didn't pursue my degree to get ahead in banking; it was something I wanted to do for myself.
_________________________
Opinions expressed are mine and not necessarily that of my employer.
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