what do you do about employees that live in glass houses? management takes this seriously! exempt officers that come in 5-20 minutes after start time of 8:00 a.m. even though we take work home, work late, work weekends, forfeit vacation days, things these people have no knowledge of. it becomes they said/you said. if the job is getting done, who do you listen to? i say nun ya, none of your business, but our president thinks this is all about what they perceive is professional behaviour... any defense you would be able to give. these people are casting stones at 25+ years employees/officers?

comments???

Exempt is exempt. You pay for performance not for people to sit unproductively at their desk for 8 hours a day. The people that complain should concentrate on thier own performance. I agree - nun-ya.

Well, as an officer, I believe that you must lead by example. If the hours say work starts at 8:00, then you should be there before 8:00 (I generally arrive 1 hour earlier than my staff, I hate traffic and it lets me get a start on my day, sometimes the only quiet time I have all day). Additionally, what type of leniency do you give your staff who arrives late. Are they admonished for coming in after 8:00? Leading by example is the best way to go. Remember, you are also more highly compensated than your employees, officer bonuses are higher, you are held to a higher standard, whether you want be or not. Set the example and live with it. If officers are continually late (and I mean a repititious pattern, not once in a while), then they should be counseled just as employees are.

At the same time, it is not the employees job to monitor when the officers arrive, and a quiet word with them about this could go a long way.

I agree with happy. Expempt status should reflect more when an employee leaves for appt such as doctors appt. not having to use sick time, personal time or vacation. They may want to adjust regularly reporting time so as not to appear late. As officers we hold ourselves at a higher standard. Walk the Talk. However, if employees are monitoring others, how is their job performance.

Professionals act as they must, not how they feel.

What about the loan officer that is in the office of a client at 8am every morning then shows up at work at 8:30 or 8:45. Why do you feel it necessary to explain that to the rest of the staff? I say to the other other folks - get a life. This crap about good examples is fine, but professionals are paid to do a job, not sit at a desk 8 to 5. I would rather have 1 top performing professional that worked for me that I didn't have to monitor whether they were in the bank every 10 minutes than 10 dead beats that came to work an hour early everyday. When I say performance, I mean performance is the key - the rest is petty BS. If you are managing your professionals at your bank based on time at desk, you are going to eventually get eaten by your competitors. If your line people want that flexibility, then they need to do what it takes to move into one of those positions. You will notice that once someone gets to that position they seem to quit complaining.

I agree with rlcary. We too have the petty BS, mostly from nonexempts. Everyone worries too much about what other people are doing (or not doing) instead of focusing on their job, responsibilities, performance, and earning their way up the corporate ladder. I do agree that officers and management should lead by example, but at the same time, officers and management should not have to justify what they do (and why) to other employees.

This once was a major problem in our area. I actually had to talk to the non-exempt staff about what it means to be non exempt. No over-time, on call, required to work whatever hours necessary to get the job done even weekends and holidays if necessary, no guaranteed lunch break. If you average my hours to what I make as an officer, per hour the non-exempt employees come out ahead.

RL - I agree that if you are conducting business offsite that is considered work. Does not need to be justified. But on days when not conducting early morning business, then by all means, be here on time. It is also about respect for the position and your company.

And someone needs to counsel those non-exempts.

I will agree if that officer is performing up to snuff. If they are meeting their goals then I say they shouldnt have to explain why they are not there when the rest of the staff is. Its actually none of the non exempts business. However, when you have a case where your officer who is your branch manager is constantly taking days off because it snows and she doesnt want to come to work, or she takes two hour lunches to go get her nails done, she doesnt meet her goals then isnt it time to do something??

When an exempt employee does these types of activities it is important to at least be a little bit discreet.

TB,

Sure it is, it's time to fire her. It's not the position that grants these rights it's the performance. If you don't perform you're out. If you do perform, I'm not going to worry about 10 minutes or even an hour here or there. That's what being exempt means.

Well thats my opinion too however I feel what will really happen is she wont get fired but if the BRANCH isnt performing we will all loose our jobs because they will just close the branch.

We have told our staff that they need to mind their own schedules and not worry about others. If you're complaining that X lender didn't show up until 8:10, you're obviously not working at 8:10...you're watching a clock.

Perhaps X lender was at a business function until 2 am and slept in. Or X lender stopped off at a clients office. Or X lender had a doctors appointment. Does X lender need to check in with the nosey staff and let them know? Absolutely not!

Half of the bank thinks I work 3 hours a day and travel for giggles the balance of the time. They have no idea what I do, but they see the fun stuff and assume it's all fun and giggles. I didn't see them over the weekend when I was here though now did I?

I'd suggest a policy that causes issues for the reporter verses the exempt person. Also, reminding them (when they tattle tale) that it is not their job to report on the exempt staff, it's the exampt staff's managers job to handle issues, goes a long way towards shutting them up.

Well I guess I thought that management should set by example. How is it fair that an exempt employee should get away with working 30 hrs a week and being paid for 40 hrs when they DO NOTHING. I know the person I am talking about does nothing. She doesnt meet her quotas, she is totally helpless, she takes two hour lunches to get her nails done. I could not agree more that it is not my business when the manager or exempt person is living up to what is required of her job. I can tell you this person I have been referring to does not do her job or any part of her job yet she doesnt get fired because we the non exempt staff make her look good.

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I can tell you this person I have been referring to does not do her job or any part of her job yet she doesnt get fired because we the non exempt staff make her look good.

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I imagine we have all worked for someone who we thought did not deserve the position he or she held. From experience, I can say that type of thing can eat you up and greatly diminish your ability to enjoy the role you play. You have two choices: 1) Get over it by focusing on your job performance and not theirs, or 2) find another job on the shaky assumption that you will not run into an even worse situation.

The only person you can change is yourself.

Happy - well said.

TB I agree with you that management should set by example, but I've heard people say the very same thing you're saying about me. Works 20 hours a week, constantly on vacation, etc.

They don't see that I'm working outside the office, bored to tears at HUD meetings, flying on weekends to visit branches, etc. Again, this is why it's the manager's job (whoever manages that person) to figure out if they're doing their job. If they are not paying attention, that's their problem, because eventually it will bite them in the bum. But it's not worth you spending time worrying about. As mentioned, you'll just stress yourself out guessing Better to enjoy your job and move on.

I can tell you I love my job and my performance is meticulous. I am the best head teller and supervisor I know how to be and I try to set the best example I can to my tellers. I just dont want my job in jeopardy because this manager doesnt do hers. I cant afford to loose my insurance and my pay if our office closes because it doesnt perform up to snuff. She gets all the recognition and big bucks while we the non exempt staff keep that office going and get measly raises and no recognition. It just wears on you after awhile. Still management should lead by example. That is something I have always beleived and always will. You cant tell your staff to do one thing while you do totally something different.

Do you have the ability to tranfer to another office? By all means, if you are as good as you say you are (and I'm not saying you aren't, just using your words, no offense intended here), you should have appraisals to back this up, and your bank would see you as a valuable asset and easily accommodate your transfer. If your appraisals don't back this up, you shouldn't be signing them. Also, you can talk to your HR department and see if there is a method for you to air this issue without repercussions on yourself.

Maybe the grass is greener on the other side of the fence - what about your competitors - maybe it's time to move on. If upper management at your insitution is that blind, what makes you think they will ever see you??

I have the appraisals to back it up and beleive me if another position opens that I am interested in I will grab it up. However, right now the office is very close to my home, I love the people I work with with the exception of the manager and she doesnt harass me she just is lazy and controling. I have worked in this office for almost eight years and seriously doubt I will leave unless another position in training maybe or something opens up. I will continue to suck it up and just vent to all you nice people here.

This has probably already been said in some form or another but each employee needs to understand their place. An Officer does need to lead by example, however it is up to their boss to monitor their commings and goings not other employees. Lower level employees need to understand that they are simply that...lower level. It sounds harsh but you work up the ladder for one reason or another and lower level employees should respect that. And the managers that play into these employees complaints are only validating them to be disrespectful. And what kind of time are these employees spending worrying about what time officers get in in the morning? The employees complaining need to be delt with unlesss you are a daycare provider because this whole issue is very childish!

When I initially began my first job as a supervisor in our Quality Control department eight years ago, I was told that as a supervisor you will be expected to take home work as well as stay after hours and that still holds true today as I've advanced to AVP of Compliance with my current employer. In addition, I was told by my boss who interviewed me for my current position that compliance is not an 8 hour job, so I knew that upon accepting the position. If I could count the number of hours spent outside the office, it would be tantamount to about four trips abroad. I've worked on various projects, including updating and maintaining our lending matrices, revising policies and procedures and repsonding to to e-mails from production managers of other business units. I should also add that this has taken place at home from my computer. I am expected to do it with a smile of my face and have answered the call and upper management in turn has compensated me well. However, on the flip side, if it is necessary that I must leave for a dental or doctor's appointment, or I need to be present when the cable repairman visits my home, then I leave the office about and hour and a half earlier and there should be no questions asked by my subordinates, given the number of outside hours I put into doing my job. The best advice I can give is to concentrate your efforts on accomplishing your duties and continue to perform to the best of your ability. Also, you may want to consider going back to school at night in order to advance and gain upward mobility. At 40 years of age, I am finding myself at having to complete my masters degree, something that I thought I'd never do, because of the demands of my job. But I think of it as making the ultimate sacrifice, because while it deprives me of some extracurricula time with family and friends, in the final analysis, I know the dividends will pay off. Take care and I hope 2005 is good to you and for everyone else here.