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#493417 - 02/03/06 08:55 PM Situational Ethics?
Jay Bruce Platinum Poster Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 546 The New Loft Chamber	Quote: Quote: Quote: I love ethical situations and discussions. Let's try to keep this discussion at a civilized level, though. We won't try to score points off of each other, but instead offer our ideas and views for discussion. Ya wanna? Suzy Perhaps we should start another thread (say "Professional Ethics"), not connected directly with the abortion issues first presented in this thread -- so as to engage a broader audience who may not be paying attention to this thread because of its title. What ethics come to bear when a person is asked to do something in his or her profession that is legal, but violates that person's moral judgment. This is meant to be a continuation of an ethics discussion in another thread. _________________________ J. Bruce "A man in a kilt is a man and a half!"
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#493418 - 02/03/06 09:02 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Erl of Baltimore Platinum Poster Joined: Jun 2003 Posts: 553 Memorial Stadium	Can you give me an event describing your question, so I may picture in my pea-brain how to develop my response. Thank you. _________________________ Dear World: WE ARE BROKE! signed: The American Public So no more money for you...now most of you can hate us for free!
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#493419 - 02/03/06 09:08 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Anonymous Unregistered	I'll start, King. My example is: Is it ethical for a Correctional Officer to turn a blind eye to an inmate that is being beaten based upon their offense? In other words, an Officer sees an inmate being beaten that is incarcerated due to robbery. He stops the beating. The next day he sees an inmate being beaten who is incarcerated due to child abuse. The officer does nothing. Is he wrong? Suzy
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#493420 - 02/03/06 09:08 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Jay Bruce Platinum Poster Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 546 The New Loft Chamber	Quote: Can you give me an event describing your question, so I may picture in my pea-brain how to develop my response. Thank you. May a pharmacist refuse to dispense a legal drug (e.g., RU486) if it is prescribed by a physician, and the woman wants the script filled? _________________________ J. Bruce "A man in a kilt is a man and a half!"
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#493421 - 02/03/06 09:13 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Jay Bruce Platinum Poster Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 546 The New Loft Chamber	Quote: Quote: Can you give me an event describing your question, so I may picture in my pea-brain how to develop my response. Thank you. May a pharmacist refuse to dispense a legal drug (e.g., RU486) if it is prescribed by a physician, and the woman wants the script filled? This is playing out in real life. See this Article. (Note, Tiffany Bruce is no relation) _________________________ J. Bruce "A man in a kilt is a man and a half!"
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#493422 - 02/03/06 09:16 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
°X° Power Poster Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 7,332 WOOHOO	You either get out of the profession or change your views. I'd say, if you are a true Liberal - stuff happens in the banking world everyday that would be against your moral values and judgment (you may not have direct knowledge of the events, but they are happening). I just don't see how liberals can reconcile being in the banking world. On the other hand: What ethics come to bear when a person is asked to do something in his or her profession that is illegal (by Senior Management)? I've had that happen within the banking world on two occasions. Each time, I said NO. Both times, I ended up (more or less) out on the street, although it was months later with no connection to be made to the events. We all must compromise each and every day, the only issue is how much.
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#493423 - 02/03/06 09:17 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
zaibatsu Power Poster Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 6,153	Quote: Quote: Aren't we off the point. I thought this was the point: Should a pharmacy, if they are not otherwise contractually restricted, be allowed to say that they don't carry or order certain prescriptions? Should the goverment pass a law that that says pharmacies may not refuse to carry or order any prescription drug? No, that was your point. Bonnie's point (please correct me if I'm wrong) was that pharmacists shouldn't be deciding what drugs are morally fit to be dispensed. No, I think Bonnie's point is that pharmacists shouldn't use their own morals to deciding what drugs are they will dispense. _________________________ Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city
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#493424 - 02/03/06 09:17 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Anonymous Unregistered	That's an interesting article, J. Bruce. Thanks for the link. Suzy
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#493425 - 02/03/06 09:40 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
zaibatsu Power Poster Joined: Jun 2001 Posts: 6,153	What I am having a hard time reconciling these two statements: A woman should be able to use her own moral compass to decide whether to have an abortion. A pharmacist should not be able to use her own moral compass to decide which drugs she will dispense. _________________________ Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city
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#493426 - 02/03/06 09:44 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Anonymous Unregistered	Quote: What I am having a hard time reconciling these two statements: A woman should be able to use her own moral compass to decide whether to have an abortion. A pharmacist should not be able to use her own moral compass to decide which drugs she will dispense. I agree with the free market theory for the pharmacist. But analogizing the choice to abortion is apples and ornages and you know it. There is no easy answer in this. Each profession comes with its own set or ethics. And those ethics are being interpreted by the individual actor.
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#493427 - 02/03/06 09:52 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
RBanker Power Poster Joined: Jul 2003 Posts: 2,675 Austin Texas	Z - I think it's pretty easy - a pharmacist takes a job in a given state where doctors are allowed to prescribe certain drugs to patients - at what point is a pharmacist allowed to override a doctors orders, other than concerns about interactions? If the pharmacist doesn't want to prescribe those drugs than it should be noted at the entrance to the store as part of the stores policy and if the pharmacist doesn't own his own store, but rather works for someone else - than either follow their rules (it's not illegal) or go work somewhere easy. Why do we make this more difficult than it is - By the same token, based on some peoples argument - I should return checks/ACH/etc to adult oriented business because I don't like them - think I would have a job long? Some folks need to quit FORCING their beliefs on others - this is where you get the term extremism. And all extremism is does is push people away - it does not draw them to you. Now having been a frequent visitor, but seldom a poster in the cooler - blast/flame/insult away!!
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#493428 - 02/03/06 09:57 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
cheekEE Power Poster Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,594 Easy Street	No flame from me Tex. You make a good point. _________________________ Some days good karma isn't worth the hassle.
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#493429 - 02/03/06 09:58 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Jay Bruce Platinum Poster Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 546 The New Loft Chamber	Quote: Some folks need to quit FORCING their beliefs on others - this is where you get the term extremism. And all extremism is does is push people away - it does not draw them to you. Folks "forcing" their views on others can also be called "legislation". And yes, we do legislate morality -- at least the morality of the majority -- such as don't steal, don't kill, don't bear false witness (hey, those sound vaguely familiar). _________________________ J. Bruce "A man in a kilt is a man and a half!"
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#493430 - 02/03/06 10:13 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Anonymous Unregistered	Can we move off of abortion for a moment and move on to something else? Surely abortion is not the end of every ethical situation. Suzy
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#493431 - 02/03/06 10:22 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
rainman Power Poster Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,238	Tex, your first sentence is the heart of the issue. The pharmacist is not overriding the physician's orders; he's just refusing to participate in them. I agree with your point about the employer - if the drugstore's policy is "we'll fill all prescriptions, no ifs ands or buts," then the pharmacist who goes against that polciy based on his/her own moral policy risks being fired - appropriately so. But the question is, if the drugstore policy is that they won't fill morning after prescriptions, or that they'll allow the pharmacists to use their own discretion, what's wrong with that? Consumers will support or not support the pharmacy with their business. Your ACH example is pretty simple. If a bank chooses to reject ACH debits originated by porn businesses, NACHA (or the regional clearinghouse) will likely revoke their membership and they won't be doing ACH's anymore. But if they want to run that risk (and take the consequences), should the government force them to accept the debit entries anyway? Quote: Some folks need to quit FORCING their beliefs on others - this is where you get the term extremism. I guess the question is which folks are forcing their beliefs on the others. By saying the state should force the pharmacist to fill the prescription, you are forcing the beliefs of the physician and the patient on the pharmacist. Again, no one is preventing the patient from getting the prescription filled - they're just saying "I won't be the one to do it." _________________________ Nobody's perfect, not even a perfect stranger.
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#493432 - 02/03/06 10:22 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Jay Bruce Platinum Poster Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 546 The New Loft Chamber	Quote: I'll start, King. My example is: Is it ethical for a Correctional Officer to turn a blind eye to an inmate that is being beaten based upon their offense? In other words, an Officer sees an inmate being beaten that is incarcerated due to robbery. He stops the beating. The next day he sees an inmate being beaten who is incarcerated due to child abuse. The officer does nothing. Is he wrong? Suzy I think the officer is morally culpable, particularly if he's the one doing the beating. What if you were a civilian witness to the officer failing to do his duty to protect an inmate? Would you report the officer? _________________________ J. Bruce "A man in a kilt is a man and a half!"
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#493433 - 02/03/06 11:01 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
straw Power Poster Joined: Nov 2002 Posts: 9,121	I asked this in the other thread but it wasn't answered. Do pharmicist have ethical codes in relation to their being certified i.e. doctor, lawyer, accountant?
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#493434 - 02/03/06 11:13 PM Re: Situational Ethics?
Anonymous Unregistered	I don't know, Straw. I would think that they would have to take the same oath as a doctor. You would have to have the same level of confidentiality. But I would just be guessing. As to the Corrections question (thanks for humoring me, J.! ), I think the officer would be morally culpable too. After all, incarceration is the punishment; they shouldn't have to be subjected to "crual and unusual" treatment as well. Or should they? If I were a civilian witness I would report the officer. Suzy
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#493435 - 02/04/06 12:10 AM Re: Situational Ethics?
Anonymous Unregistered	Quote: I just don't see how liberals can reconcile being in the banking world. That's probably because, judging by your comments, there doesn't seem to be anyone that knows less about what liberals actually believe than you do.
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