Skip to content
BOL Conferences
Learn More - Click Here!

Thread Options
#172737 - 03/24/04 01:35 PM 9/11 Hearings
zaibatsu Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
Does anyone else find these 9/11 Hearings utter nonsense? What is going to come of all of this? We'll probably get a 2000 page report outlining the failings of the Clinton and Bush administrations that will sit and gather dust somewhere. Both administrations took a law enforcement attitude toward bin laden until 9/11. Why don't we also have a hearing outlining the failings of our congress, weren't they on the job during that time also?

What a waste of time!!!

What we should be doing is having hearings to examine whether we are safer now and what can be done to make us even safer. In my work and at my home, I find finger pointing a humongous waste of time. Let's find a solution to the problems.

Oh, and by the way, the problem is not Clinton and it is not Bush...it is al Queda.

OK, I feel much better now that I have gotten that out.
_________________________
Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city

Return to Top
Chat! - BOL Watercooler
#172738 - 03/24/04 01:39 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Retired DQ Offline
10K Club
Retired DQ
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 40,766
Turnpike Exit 10
Wow Z, we actually see eye-to-eye on this one!
_________________________
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please. - Mark Twain

Return to Top
#172739 - 03/24/04 01:58 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Sinatra Fan Offline
Power Poster
Sinatra Fan
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,568
New Jersey
These hearings are symptomatic of the seemingly relentless need in this country to affix blame for everything to someone (but not to me, of course).
_________________________
Management is doing things right; leadership is doing the right things. Peter Drucker

Return to Top
#172740 - 03/24/04 01:58 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
zaibatsu Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
Right after I posted that, I saw this article in the Washington Times (these are excerpts--the entire article is here: Finger Pointing ):

This week's September 11 hearings and former anti-terrorism staffer Richard Clarke's just released charges of Bush administration incompetence should be seen as just the latest example of how America historically has reacted to the outbreak of a major war.
The sudden commencementof major war is so shocking and disruptive of normal civilized life, thatthere seems to be a psychological need for the event to be explainedin termsof treachery or stupendous incompetence. It is too disturbing to accept the reality -- that normal government officials, performing as they normally are expected to, were inadequate to avoid the catastrophe....

After Pearl Harbor, Adm. Kimmel and Gen. Short, the top navy and army men at Pearl Harbor, were promptly scapegoated and fired. Ever since, and continuing to this day, books are published suggestingthatPresident Franklin Roosevelt conspiratorially knew about the attack before it came....

(It was) inevitable that America would be forced into military response -- whether at Pearl Harbor in December 1941, or someplace else within the next few years. Ultimately what mattered was how FDR and America fought the war....

For us, today, the hearings and frantic finger-pointing about September 11 are as silly and pointless as they are inevitable. The emergence of Islamist terrorism has been a good half century in the making -- from the theoretical writings by Egyptian intellectuals at the middle of the last century to September 11 and beyond. The clash between our civilization and that force was probably inevitable. If the event of September 11 had failed for any reason, there would have been another day and another disaster.
Obviously both the Clinton administration and the Bush administration until September 11 failed to be seized of a sufficient sense of urgency in combating the danger. But it is unfair to blame them -- they existed in a different political world. If Bill Clinton had tried to go to war in Afghanistan in 1998, both the Republicans and the major media would have run him out of town. So, also, would a Bush invasion of Afghanistan in July of 2001 been rebuffed by the entire body politic.
Watching officials from both administrations pointing fingers at each other this week did not advance the great cause of national security -- but what else could they do under the circumstances? The purpose of the hearing is finger-pointing.

Even today, neither John Kerry nor George Bush (nor any other politician or media outlet) are responding with urgency to the implications of the Madrid bombing. Who amongst us all are prepared to call for cancellation of all passenger trains and subway systems until we can institute an airport standard of security for train travel? It would seem excessive -- unless the terrorists blow up a subway train at rush hour in New York. Then we will act -- and point fingers at those who failed to act sooner.

Fifty years from now the ludicrous accusations of individual culpability being tossed around this week will be remembered for only one reason: That such self-serving theatrics delayed the time when we came together as a nation to more fully prepare for the worse terrorist onslaughts that are still ahead of us.
_________________________
Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city

Return to Top
#172741 - 03/24/04 02:23 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
DawgFan Offline
Diamond Poster
DawgFan
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,678
United States
I've decided to get out of the compliance business. I am going to start competing with C-Span. What do you guys think. My new network will be called "Grandstanding". We'll have wall to wall coverage of the 9/11 hearings. Our ad will go something like this:

"Watch 70 year old blowhards point fingers at each other and act like little kids. Live on Grandstanding, your home for useless political activities".

I guess we need a couple of hot infobabes and a couple of debonair GQ male anchors to keep everyone's attention.
_________________________
Opinions expressed are solely my own.

Return to Top
#172742 - 03/24/04 02:33 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
zaibatsu Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
They were going to issue the report in May. Now, it has been put off. If you did not think this whole thing was politicized, consider the date it is due...the first day of the Democratic convention. They ought to put this off until after the election, otherwise, all we are going to get it is a 2000 page political ad. That is not what the American people need. We need safety--partisan bickering just emboldens the enemy.
_________________________
Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city

Return to Top
#172743 - 03/24/04 02:49 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
redsfan Offline
Power Poster
redsfan
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 3,455
The Pennant Race
Nothing this commission does or writes will in any way contribute to the security of the American people.
_________________________
The opinions expressed here are personal and do not represent opinions of my employer.

Return to Top
#172744 - 03/24/04 04:52 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
DawgFan Offline
Diamond Poster
DawgFan
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,678
United States
Quote:

Nothing this commission does or writes will in any way contribute to the security of the American people.




Hear hear! In fact, I am of the belief that they put our security in further jeopardy. One, this shows the terrorists that we are interested in pointing fingers at each other rather than chasing them. Two, I am sure they are hoping that this hurts Bush. I don't intend this as a slam at Kerry, but they know what they will get with four mor years of GWB. More arrests, more seizing of assets, and more of their comrades blown to smithereens. Kerry has not been in a position to give them trouble. Three, every moment Rumsfeld, Rice, Powell, Tenet, Bush, et.al., spend talking to this stupid commission is one moment less they could be spending working on our National Security. Sure, we know that both Bush and Clinton made mistakes here. (I am a little suspicious at why Bush is catching so much h*** when this happened only nine months into his presidency, but the buck does stop with him). To hold these hearings is nothing more than Monday morning quarterbacking and political grandstanding. What the commission ought to investigate is how we improve and change our intelligence and military systems to fight what is essentially a worldwide guerilla war.
_________________________
Opinions expressed are solely my own.

Return to Top
#172745 - 03/24/04 07:17 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
TTC Queen Offline
Diamond Poster
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,119
Oklahoma
I have this vision or all the assorted terrorists groups sitting pointing & laughing--"See what we caused. See what we can do to the great USA" etc. We are not focusing on solving (if there is such a thing) or defeating the problem of terrorism, when we are pointing fingers and blaming each other.
_________________________
Blessed are the cracked, for it is they who let in the light. (Boy is it bright around me!)

Return to Top
#172746 - 03/24/04 07:23 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
zaibatsu Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
Quote:

I have this vision or all the assorted terrorists groups sitting pointing & laughing--"See what we caused. See what we can do to the great USA" etc. We are not focusing on solving (if there is such a thing) or defeating the problem of terrorism, when we are pointing fingers and blaming each other.




Ditto! We should write our congressmen to tell them just that. We are not impressed. It will not influence how we vote in November except to make it less likely to vote for those who are politicizing this. Congress at its worst (well, maybe not its worst).
_________________________
Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city

Return to Top
#172747 - 03/24/04 07:29 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Snowqueen Offline
Diamond Poster
Snowqueen
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,289
dreaming of a warm beach......
All this finger pointing shows what a sorry state our government is in. Look at all the finger pointing that occurred over Janet Jackson at the Superbowl. Did that really have to go to Congress? Look at the Clinton/Lewinsky hearings. What a waste of time and energy. Do you really think that GWB made everyone of the decisions leading up to and following 9/11...no. He has advisors, they feed him all the information that he tells us.

I agree that we should be spending more time on resolving the security issues, working towards a safer country, etc. STOP THE FINGER POINTING!!!!!!!

Return to Top
#172748 - 03/24/04 09:14 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Pale Rider Offline
10K Club
Pale Rider
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 34,318
under the Lone Star
Hey Z:

I don't know about you but I feel so encouraged today after Mr. Clarke apologized on behalf of the whole federal government for letting us down. And I really believed him when he tried to get President Bush and his advisors to make terrorism a priority, and especially going after Al Quaida. But they were only interested in Iraq. Well, what was Afganistan about ? This guy is up to his eyeballs in rationalizing that he and his cohorts did nothing about terrorism in the 90's because it was basically a police action. How exasperating !
_________________________
Societies that do not find work in and of itself "pleasing to God and requisite to Man," tend to be highly corrupt.


Return to Top
#172749 - 03/24/04 09:40 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
HRH Dawnie Offline
Power Poster
HRH Dawnie
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 7,353
Anchorage Alaska
Quote:

What a waste of time!!!




I agree Z (shocking huh?) But also, What a waste of MONEY! This will cost the tax payers a fortune.
_________________________
Dawn Coursey VP/CRA Queen

CRA Rating is in...Oh who cares...I'm home with the baby.

Return to Top
#172750 - 03/24/04 09:45 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Paragon Offline
Diamond Poster
Paragon
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,164
I will watch the repeat this weekend, but one question I have is what did Mr. Clarke actually accomplish within his position as a lot of stuff happened on his watch with everyone but him a problem.

Return to Top
#172751 - 03/24/04 09:46 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
zaibatsu Offline
Power Poster
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 6,153
Quote:

I don't know about you but I feel so encouraged today after Mr. Clarke apologized on behalf of the whole federal government for letting us down.




I think that Mr. Clarke's actions assure that from this day forward every president following a president from the opposing party will clean house upon taking action. He has compromised our national security because from this day forward there will be no continuity of security staff between presidents from different parties. It is a shame that this shameless, profiteering, hack will have such a long lasting effect on our national security.
_________________________
Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city

Return to Top
#172752 - 03/24/04 09:51 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Lestie G Offline

Power Poster
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,608
Near the Land of Enchantment
Quote:

What a waste of MONEY! This will cost the tax payers a fortune.




How can you say that!? We get to see how important and attractive our illustrious Congressmen and women are, and we get to be dazzled by their intellect in the questions they ask. AND, we get to be moved by their shock at such awful actions, and awed by their strong leadership in 'getting to the bottom of this!'
_________________________
Opinions my own.

Return to Top
#172753 - 03/24/04 10:00 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
CRAatBOK Offline

Power Poster
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 6,172
Further South than I wanna be.
Yeah, but at least it got them away from talking about the true definition of marriage. (for a while at least)
_________________________
Life is not the way it's supposed to be. It's the way it is. The way you cope with it is what makes the difference.

Return to Top
#172754 - 03/24/04 10:37 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
DawgFan Offline
Diamond Poster
DawgFan
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 1,678
United States
Lestie, you shouldn't put your tongue so firmly in your cheek. You'll poke a hole in your face.
_________________________
Opinions expressed are solely my own.

Return to Top
#172755 - 03/24/04 11:24 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Lestie G Offline

Power Poster
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,608
Near the Land of Enchantment
I was wondering why that bruise popped up on my cheek this afternoon!
_________________________
Opinions my own.

Return to Top
#172756 - 03/25/04 06:17 AM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Princess Romeo Offline

Power Poster
Princess Romeo
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 8,272
Where the heart is
After being in the corporate world for longer than I care to remember, after being involved in non-profit groups on various issues, after seeing local, state, and national government in action, after viewing arguments at church over WALLPAPER (!), after seeing how various industries handle their dirty laundry and let self interests interfere with the greater good (also known as pissing in your drinking water) I've come to two conclusions:

1. Our greatest problem is our own tendancy toward incompetence.

2. Our greatest protection is everyone else's tendancy for incompetence.

I can only picture the arguments among factions of Al Quida that the destruction of 9/11 would have been much greater if only.....

BTW - When I first typed incompetence, I spelled it wrong.
_________________________
CRCM,CAMS
Regulations are a poor substitute for ethics.
Just sayin'

Return to Top
#172757 - 03/25/04 02:05 PM Re: 9/11 Hearings
Sinatra Fan Offline
Power Poster
Sinatra Fan
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,568
New Jersey
This need or desire to affix blame to anyone else but myself goes all the way back to the garden of Eden. Remember Adam's attempted justification of himself to God? "The woman you gave me . . ." Unfortunately, we are all truly Adam's descendants.
_________________________
Management is doing things right; leadership is doing the right things. Peter Drucker

Return to Top