Today happens to be my best friend's birthday (25). He started this huge plan to celebrate his engagement with his girlfriend about a month ago, and on Saturday night he wants all of us (including his family) to go to some fancy restaurant, and then out for drinks afterwards.

First, I have some issues. They are not even engaged yet, and he's not going to ask her at dinner. She picked the ring out, and even knows that he has it - BUT he has not given it to her yet. My friend has not asked the girl's father (like he should - she told him this), and he said "she's expecting it at dinner" and he wants it to be a surprise. HELLO - SHE WAS WITH YOU WHEN YOU BOUGHT IT, AND KNOWS WHERE IT IS!!!! How much of a surprise could it be? Why are we then going to this super expensive dinner??? Am I right or wrong to say anything?

SECOND TOPIC - I have problems with their whole relationship. They both still live at home (not that there is anything wrong with that) but they will continue to live at home IF they get engaged. I think that part of the reason that they want to get engaged is that her parents (even though she's 24) will not let her live with him until they are married (uber religious). Neither has the best job in the world - he has a job but needs to file bankruptcy (credit card problems years ago - yet he still financed a $4000 ring), and she's a hair dresser (who is barely making it as she is). They've been dating for less then 6 months (I know because today is my six month anniversary with my girlfriend).

I see nothing but problems ahead, but he's been my bestfriend my whole life (his mom grew up across the street from my mom), so I feel like it is my "guy duty" to just shut my mouth and stand by what he decides.

Help.

There's no easy answer to this one, SB. However, while you may feel like you are watching a trainwreak, it's their relationship, not yours (same with the financial issues). They may have very different standards and expectations. Have you expressed your concerns to your friend? I think it would be appropriate for you to do so, if you are as close as you say, but don't do it that night. If you go, celebrate with them and don't ruin their evening. If you don't feel that you can be totally positive don't go. Despite your feelings about the situation, your friend deserves to have a good time without feeling like you are there to judge them.

If he is your best friend then you should be able to talk to him. Does he respect your opinion? Tell him how you feel. Of course that doesn't mean he is going to change his mind and if you two are as close as you say you are you both know are going love (best friend guy love, like a brother) him anyway. That is no reason to lose a friend.

I hope all works out well for you and him. Sometimes people have to learn things the hard way. I've learned a few things the hard way in my time.

If they are paying for dinner. Go have a good meal and enjoy.

As for the relationship you need to keep quiet. It's his life not yours. Nothing good will come of you telling him otherwise.

Good luck.

Sounds similar to my oldest son's (25) best friend. He's already been married, divorced and getting remarried. They fight, act immature, don't have financial stability, blah...blah...blah.

My son expresses a portion of his opinion but mostly keeps it to himself. He goes along with the flow, keeps the friendship and feels from watching his friend he may now be able to better judge his own personal relationships.

What's more important....paying for a fancy dinner or keeping the friendship??? Your decision to make.

Sometimes when you tell them how you feel and it's not a postivie note ... in their eyes... it will only drive them closer to that person.

I know, speaking from past relationships, when my friends and family did not think I was with the right guy... it seemed that their words made me determined to prove that they were wrong...yes, in the long run... they were right... but at that time I never saw how right they were...all I was seeing was the fact that they were disapproving of the person I choose to be with, and putting him down... so I felt I needed to be with him even more.

You're in a tough situation...but I think if you tell how you see things he might not agree with you and cling closer to her...

Good luck.

Yes, it is your guy duty to give him a swift kick! You should have also told him to charge the ring, then claim bankruptcy...all before October 17th. Exactly in that order too.

I'll bet it's the sex. There's no other reason why a guy would be this irrational!

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so I feel like it is my "guy duty" to just shut my mouth and stand by what he decides.

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Skunky...be real. According to the Man Show, your Guy Duty is to sleep with the girlfriend, take pictures to show your friend what a tramp she is, and get him to dump her...That will solve all of these problems.

Nice!

Does she have a badonkadonk?

I can't imagine getting married without ever having lived on your own or with a roommate.

I mean, try sharing a dorm room and monthly bills with your best friend, and see what tension arises.

Skunk Boy, I can't speak to your first concern, but feel qualified to address your second.

My wife (we'll be celebrating our 25th wedding anniversary in February) and I got engaged after having dated for five weeks and corresponding by mail for another 2 months after she moved back home from spending the summer with her older sister. This was before Internet, cell phones, e-mail, etc. At the time we got engaged she was 17 and I was 20. She was a senior in high school living at home and I was a sophomore in college and living with my grandmother. First, just because we got engaged then, we didn't get married then. Our engagement lasted 16 months. During that time, we continued our letter correspondence and dating during holidays and after she graduated from high school and moved back down to SC with her sister.

I was extremely poor and so was my wife. We were both working for McDonalds at the time we got married. Our first home as husband and wife was a run down single-wide mobile home. I was in debt up to my eyeballs. I was financing my college education on my own with GI bill assistance, but wound up dropping out after we got married and working full time as an assistant manager for McDonalds. It was another five years before I finally graduated from college.

Eventually, I got my life in order and on track and consider myself to be very successful now. And our marriage has lasted and is stronger today than ever. Sometimes the most difficult circumstances can forge the strongest resolve and commitment.

So I say to you this - does their potential marriage face challenges? Absolutely. Should you ensure they understand this? As much as you can. But they probably won't listen. I know we didn't. Should you do something to try to talk them out of this? I don't think so.

I nearly lost my best friend because I let her know that I didn't think she should get married. She is now divorced and remarried and agrees that she should not have married guy #1.

But...you can't tell someone what to do. You just have to be there for them when they finally figure it out.

The best thing you can do right now is listen. Ask him non-judgemental questions like "Are you happy?" and let him talk to you. It seems like the person in the relationship is always the last one to figure it out.

You sound like a really good friend. Good luck with this!

My friend is now engaged. He did it at dinner, in front of everyone. It was kinda exciting (except we all figured it was going to happen then). He did ask her dad before, which was a really good thing.

I'm happy for them, and wish them the best.

Yeah, congrats to your friend...

Gutsy move, in front of everyone. What if she said no?

he said she helped him pick the ring so she knew it was coming, and if she still said no that would have been pretty messed up lol

But it wouldn't be the first time a woman changed her mind...

haha good point